So I currently use hydra k from ABS. My new syndicate feed the lake with sticky's krill and I'd say 90% of the lads on there also use sticky's krill. Question is would you stick with hydra k or swap over to sticky? I'm in two minds as to whether because the fish see that much of the sticky they will see it as a natural food source or would using the hydra k be an edge with it still being krill but different in its make up?
In reply to Post #1
Could go either way really, why not try 50/50 mix?
Could go either way really, why not try 50/50 mix?
Stick with the bait personally. If you've got confidence in it already it will be one less thing to worry about.
In reply to Post #1
Don't change unless you have to
Don't change unless you have to
In reply to Post #1
Stick with the Hydra K but have some Sticky baits in reserve should it not go as planned.
Stick with the Hydra K but have some Sticky baits in reserve should it not go as planned.
In reply to Post #1
Sticky Krill is, ingredients wise a superior bait.
Would using a different bait if fish are preoccupied on one be an edge? possibly.
My recommendation would be to try both, and maybe on the third rod try something completely different such as tigers, maize, peperami etc.
If the fish are hard wired to one bait though, and the alternatives dont work, just jump on the band wagon and fish better for better results.
The amount of consistent superior match anglers winning on fishery pellets tells us even with a dominant bait approach can put you ahead
Sticky Krill is, ingredients wise a superior bait.
Would using a different bait if fish are preoccupied on one be an edge? possibly.
My recommendation would be to try both, and maybe on the third rod try something completely different such as tigers, maize, peperami etc.
If the fish are hard wired to one bait though, and the alternatives dont work, just jump on the band wagon and fish better for better results.
The amount of consistent superior match anglers winning on fishery pellets tells us even with a dominant bait approach can put you ahead
In reply to Post #6
Curious to know, how can you state that Sticky Krill has superior ingredients over Active Bait Solutions bait?
Curious to know, how can you state that Sticky Krill has superior ingredients over Active Bait Solutions bait?
In reply to Post #7
I'd be interested to know that as well as I have always been told hydra k has the better quality ingredients
I'd be interested to know that as well as I have always been told hydra k has the better quality ingredients
Mozzi seams to know the ins and outs and the day to day running of all bait companies. Have faith in Hydra k. But also have a back up as a plan b. All about confidence. Hope you get the results 
In reply to Post #6
Not sure I'd agree with that statement . Hydra k is an active bait , sticky krill is not . Both awesome baits though
Not sure I'd agree with that statement . Hydra k is an active bait , sticky krill is not . Both awesome baits though
In reply to Post #9
Trust me, he doesn't.
Trust me, he doesn't.
In reply to Post #6
The krill is superior ingredient wise than hydra k? Wow ! BIG STATEMENT THAT!
The krill is superior ingredient wise than hydra k? Wow ! BIG STATEMENT THAT!
In reply to Post #10
Hydra k is an active bait , sticky krill is not... is Krill active not the same as HK active ?
Hydra k is an active bait , sticky krill is not... is Krill active not the same as HK active ?
In reply to Post #12
Especially when they all use the same bunch of suppliers for ingredients too.
Reminds me of two years ago when a certain shrimp hydro arrived on the market and a month later 20 different companies started selling it claiming they “found” it and it's more special than the next one, in reality it all came from the same place and could bought without the inflated prices from bait companies.
Especially when they all use the same bunch of suppliers for ingredients too.
Reminds me of two years ago when a certain shrimp hydro arrived on the market and a month later 20 different companies started selling it claiming they “found” it and it's more special than the next one, in reality it all came from the same place and could bought without the inflated prices from bait companies.
In reply to Post #14
I dont believe the fishery actually feed sticky krill - why would you? So many better nutritional baits and so many decent ones so much cheaper.
I dont believe the fishery actually feed sticky krill - why would you? So many better nutritional baits and so many decent ones so much cheaper.
In reply to Post #15
It's not necessarily saleable bait, I doubt they are opening up 5kg bags and chucking it in but every factory has wastage that needs to go somewhere.
It's not necessarily saleable bait, I doubt they are opening up 5kg bags and chucking it in but every factory has wastage that needs to go somewhere.
In reply to Post #6
Can you list the Ingrediants and levels in both so we can compare ?
Can you list the Ingrediants and levels in both so we can compare ?
In reply to Post #10
None of them are truly "active" baits in the sense of accelerated break down, Hydra K comes in a shelf life option for starters.
Its not a big statement to say one of the largest bait rollers and suppliers in the world makes a better bait, fairly sure ABS don't get their ingredient from the same place as sticky as they don't use enough.
I've never claimed hydra k to be a bad bait, its just ingredients wise and nutritionally inferior.
I will not publish any numerative info I have on the baits as thats out of order to each company.
None of them are truly "active" baits in the sense of accelerated break down, Hydra K comes in a shelf life option for starters.
Its not a big statement to say one of the largest bait rollers and suppliers in the world makes a better bait, fairly sure ABS don't get their ingredient from the same place as sticky as they don't use enough.
I've never claimed hydra k to be a bad bait, its just ingredients wise and nutritionally inferior.
I will not publish any numerative info I have on the baits as thats out of order to each company.
In reply to Post #9
You've literally logged in for the first time in months and seem to only ever log on to comment on ABS bait, zero impartiality from you
You've literally logged in for the first time in months and seem to only ever log on to comment on ABS bait, zero impartiality from you
In reply to Post #16
whilst some companies do stickys operation is very efficient, I'm sure with recovery built into their production lines and some of the consultants wanting the old randoms there wont be a lot of wastage, think they have financial ties to the willows syndicate so some may go in there
whilst some companies do stickys operation is very efficient, I'm sure with recovery built into their production lines and some of the consultants wanting the old randoms there wont be a lot of wastage, think they have financial ties to the willows syndicate so some may go in there
In reply to Post #18
so just to quell a few unsubstantiated rumours on here....
Sticky do not have a exclusive supply base to any other of the big rolling companies - i know for a fact they buy several ingredients from the same companies as Nash, Mainline, & Abs to mention a few. I know the account manager who sell's it to them as i previously worked for the same group.
I think some are living under the impression that bait companies are big players in the aqua feed / ingredient world... they are anything but.... what one company buys will be available to them all in the same minimum order spec's.
I cant see how publishing a nutritional info profile for bait would be out of order if you have them? however im sure some could argue in that being on a part of the make up to a "good" bait
so just to quell a few unsubstantiated rumours on here....
Sticky do not have a exclusive supply base to any other of the big rolling companies - i know for a fact they buy several ingredients from the same companies as Nash, Mainline, & Abs to mention a few. I know the account manager who sell's it to them as i previously worked for the same group.
I think some are living under the impression that bait companies are big players in the aqua feed / ingredient world... they are anything but.... what one company buys will be available to them all in the same minimum order spec's.
I cant see how publishing a nutritional info profile for bait would be out of order if you have them? however im sure some could argue in that being on a part of the make up to a "good" bait
In reply to Post #18
If you're talking about size of rolling operation being an indication of quality, pretty sure Marco makes a whole lot more than Sticky. Lol.
Cant see how publishing the ingredients is out of order, most baits are pretty similar tbh. And in Europe they have to have them on the bag anyway.
If you're talking about size of rolling operation being an indication of quality, pretty sure Marco makes a whole lot more than Sticky. Lol.
Cant see how publishing the ingredients is out of order, most baits are pretty similar tbh. And in Europe they have to have them on the bag anyway.
In reply to Post #18
To be fair I didn't mean supplier as in distributor. I mean the brand of ingredient. Take krill meal for instance, there is a small number of companies that “make” krill meal. And anyone from a huge bait company to someone rolling bait for themselves in their shed can get access to every single different brand of krill meal.
I'd be sure that ABS roll enough to be buying ICBs and hitting minimum orders for a majority of distributors out there. And regardless, they are all distributing the same products. It's like going in to tesco and being told you can't buy Nescafé coffee so going to sainsburys and buying Nescafé coffee isn't it
To be fair I didn't mean supplier as in distributor. I mean the brand of ingredient. Take krill meal for instance, there is a small number of companies that “make” krill meal. And anyone from a huge bait company to someone rolling bait for themselves in their shed can get access to every single different brand of krill meal.
I'd be sure that ABS roll enough to be buying ICBs and hitting minimum orders for a majority of distributors out there. And regardless, they are all distributing the same products. It's like going in to tesco and being told you can't buy Nescafé coffee so going to sainsburys and buying Nescafé coffee isn't it
I have a fair bit of sticky krill active taking up space in the freezer, if you stick on it give me a shout we can sort something out I am sure
In reply to Post #19
I've never said I was impartial, and I've also stated that I'm an ABS customer. Yes I don't login often. But when I do all I see is posts from you on every subject while you spread your “knowledge” Well done for doing your research. Pity you don't do the same when your spouting about companies. Giving an opinion and degrading other companies are totally different with no evidence. All that need to be said was “I would go with sticky” far “superior ingredients” implies you know. So to help the person out fully is publish both recipes and let them make their own decision.
I've never said I was impartial, and I've also stated that I'm an ABS customer. Yes I don't login often. But when I do all I see is posts from you on every subject while you spread your “knowledge” Well done for doing your research. Pity you don't do the same when your spouting about companies. Giving an opinion and degrading other companies are totally different with no evidence. All that need to be said was “I would go with sticky” far “superior ingredients” implies you know. So to help the person out fully is publish both recipes and let them make their own decision.
In reply to Post #25
I love how the entire bait world is all “rumours” and here say. It must be impossible for newcomers to make any sense of where to buy decent bait.
It's a market which is completely saturated and full of absolute lies. There are good baits and bad baits. Use them and make your own minds up or like I said before, get someone more in the loop (the honest one) to help you choose.
Keeperboy
I love how the entire bait world is all “rumours” and here say. It must be impossible for newcomers to make any sense of where to buy decent bait.
It's a market which is completely saturated and full of absolute lies. There are good baits and bad baits. Use them and make your own minds up or like I said before, get someone more in the loop (the honest one) to help you choose.
Keeperboy
In reply to Post #26
That's the problem - everyone's an expert so how do they know who to trust?
That's the problem - everyone's an expert so how do they know who to trust?
In reply to Post #26
Well said.
The art of bait making is lost on many newcomers/ready rolled users.
Business bait companies know other Business owners, they talk to each other.
They can only go on fellow angler capture whilst fishing same venues, Clever marketing, friends recommendations, social media, to find your own happy bait.
If you still cannot make your mind up on a bait to use.
You could learn to make a boilie base mix from scratch. Plenty of advice and mixes on here. Then you know, what is what, and why it is in there, and the cost of good quality ingredients.
Well said.
The art of bait making is lost on many newcomers/ready rolled users.
Business bait companies know other Business owners, they talk to each other.
They can only go on fellow angler capture whilst fishing same venues, Clever marketing, friends recommendations, social media, to find your own happy bait.
If you still cannot make your mind up on a bait to use.
You could learn to make a boilie base mix from scratch. Plenty of advice and mixes on here. Then you know, what is what, and why it is in there, and the cost of good quality ingredients.
In reply to Post #15
Believe me they do feed sticky krill into the lake. Think I might fish them side by side for a while see what happens
Believe me they do feed sticky krill into the lake. Think I might fish them side by side for a while see what happens
In reply to Post #7
15 years ago I was fishing Farlows it had so much cell chucked in it people caught on it I was using the big fish mix and did as well if not better.
I thought active bait supplies a large quantity to the bait industry the only other provider be it a small bait company I'm aware of that does his own thing is John Baker.
15 years ago I was fishing Farlows it had so much cell chucked in it people caught on it I was using the big fish mix and did as well if not better.
I thought active bait supplies a large quantity to the bait industry the only other provider be it a small bait company I'm aware of that does his own thing is John Baker.
The amusing thing about the whole boilie argument is how many great captures have nothing to do with a boiled ball of animal feed by- product. Simon Scott with a handful of corn, Steve Pag with a handful of pellet, Lee J on bread sticks and corn, the Thames 50 on peanuts, the Burghfield fish on tigers over seeds.. the list goes on.
No doubt a well rounded boilie is a good way to feed the fish, and better to put good food in a lake than rubbish. But, can we honestly say that boilies really live up to all the waffle that is punted out there?
It's a £xxxxxxx industry built on faux science, garden shed theory, blanking insecurity, smoke, mirrors and money.
No doubt a well rounded boilie is a good way to feed the fish, and better to put good food in a lake than rubbish. But, can we honestly say that boilies really live up to all the waffle that is punted out there?
It's a £xxxxxxx industry built on faux science, garden shed theory, blanking insecurity, smoke, mirrors and money.
In reply to Post #26
Amen
Amen
In reply to Post #31
I agree with you about the bull. However that is not the boilies fault. The whole modern carp angling scene is built on the arrival of the commercial boilie and the hair rig at about the same time.
Naturals, plastics, meats etc are great baits and have caught many famous fish but boilies and the hair are the foundation the whole money making circus. They made catching carp easy. In 1970 it wasn't.
I agree with you about the bull. However that is not the boilies fault. The whole modern carp angling scene is built on the arrival of the commercial boilie and the hair rig at about the same time.
Naturals, plastics, meats etc are great baits and have caught many famous fish but boilies and the hair are the foundation the whole money making circus. They made catching carp easy. In 1970 it wasn't.
In reply to Post #31
It's a bit off the original topic but boilies were developed to avoid nuisance fish and catch carp. Other baits are great in carp only waters, of which there are many nowadays. However that wasn't the case when they were first made.
It's a bit off the original topic but boilies were developed to avoid nuisance fish and catch carp. Other baits are great in carp only waters, of which there are many nowadays. However that wasn't the case when they were first made.
In reply to Post #31
Good baits are a game changer, I'll stick my neck out here and say it as it is but boilies are the one thing I actually prefer and want to use now
It's the perfect package to avoid other species and send the signals I want to send....... But there is so much junk out there and yes there is so much hype etc that it's hard to see through. When you have confidence in certain baits you won't ever need to look for anything else apart from a zig!
Good baits are a game changer, I'll stick my neck out here and say it as it is but boilies are the one thing I actually prefer and want to use now
It's the perfect package to avoid other species and send the signals I want to send....... But there is so much junk out there and yes there is so much hype etc that it's hard to see through. When you have confidence in certain baits you won't ever need to look for anything else apart from a zig!
In reply to Post #35
Yes
Yes
There is no denying seed, tigers, corn and the like catch a lot of fish and will continue to do so. However when you have a High quality boilie it can really make a difference. It's something I've experienced over the last few years and I would never go back to a bait that costs 6 quid a kilo. The difference has been really noticeable not just on my wallet 😂 but also in my results.
In reply to Post #37
You do know sticky, mainline, etc all cost around that. You just pay markup on it from retailers.
You can get bait at £6 a kilo or less even when buying in bulk from plenty of proven companies.
You do know sticky, mainline, etc all cost around that. You just pay markup on it from retailers.
You can get bait at £6 a kilo or less even when buying in bulk from plenty of proven companies.
In reply to Post #38
Absolutely all depends on what you want in a bait. A £2 bait that retails for £6 or a more expensive bait. I'm happy to pay considerably more for a bait I know is of better quality as I dont want to be fishing the same £6 a kilo stuff everyone else is throwing in.
Absolutely all depends on what you want in a bait. A £2 bait that retails for £6 or a more expensive bait. I'm happy to pay considerably more for a bait I know is of better quality as I dont want to be fishing the same £6 a kilo stuff everyone else is throwing in.
In reply to Post #39
As long as you 100% know it's of a better quality then it makes sense. Only way to do that is to make it yourself though, or by a trusted friend. Otherwise you're solely relying on what someone else is telling you is in it. I'm not quite sure your correct on the whole “of it costs more it's better” thing tbh. The bulk that the likes of mainline buy in, those £11 boilies are costing them very little to make. Which kind of flaws your point. Economies of scale, etc. I could make a £11 a kilo boilie (without Labour) in my garage, mainline could make the same quality in bulk for £3 a kilo due to buying in bulk. Why would one be better than the other?
Like I mentioned previously, a certain shrimp hydro is being sold by multiple brands saying there one is the best and better quality, etc. it's all the same product, decanted from a large container in to small bottles, all being sold at different prices (albeit not by much). The £6 a bottle is the same as the £9 a bottle.
As long as you 100% know it's of a better quality then it makes sense. Only way to do that is to make it yourself though, or by a trusted friend. Otherwise you're solely relying on what someone else is telling you is in it. I'm not quite sure your correct on the whole “of it costs more it's better” thing tbh. The bulk that the likes of mainline buy in, those £11 boilies are costing them very little to make. Which kind of flaws your point. Economies of scale, etc. I could make a £11 a kilo boilie (without Labour) in my garage, mainline could make the same quality in bulk for £3 a kilo due to buying in bulk. Why would one be better than the other?
Like I mentioned previously, a certain shrimp hydro is being sold by multiple brands saying there one is the best and better quality, etc. it's all the same product, decanted from a large container in to small bottles, all being sold at different prices (albeit not by much). The £6 a bottle is the same as the £9 a bottle.
In reply to Post #39
You realise any bait you find in a retail environment is usually made for 25% of the advertised cost?
Expensive doesn't always mean better though, as I have said before there is some right dog poo being peddled for premium prices, - even direct now, one company, whose owner has zero carp bait knowledge, is selling glow in the dark pop ups and a wide range of baits at £11 / kg.
There is baits out there selling for £12 in tackle shops that has so much bread crumb in its recipe it should state hovis on the package.
Unless you've worked with baits, seen what each individual ingredient does in a mix, utilised its individual properties, its also very difficult to look at a recipe and judge if the quality ingredients listed are in there is meaningful amounts. you could put 5g of CPSP90 in there and put it on the label for example.
For the sort of money you're willing to pay for bait you could easily get a recipe rolled for you of your own concoction by any number of firms, if you keep a kilo of the original you'd know if they were "cutting it" and that'd solve the trust crisis
You realise any bait you find in a retail environment is usually made for 25% of the advertised cost?
Expensive doesn't always mean better though, as I have said before there is some right dog poo being peddled for premium prices, - even direct now, one company, whose owner has zero carp bait knowledge, is selling glow in the dark pop ups and a wide range of baits at £11 / kg.
There is baits out there selling for £12 in tackle shops that has so much bread crumb in its recipe it should state hovis on the package.
Unless you've worked with baits, seen what each individual ingredient does in a mix, utilised its individual properties, its also very difficult to look at a recipe and judge if the quality ingredients listed are in there is meaningful amounts. you could put 5g of CPSP90 in there and put it on the label for example.
For the sort of money you're willing to pay for bait you could easily get a recipe rolled for you of your own concoction by any number of firms, if you keep a kilo of the original you'd know if they were "cutting it" and that'd solve the trust crisis
In reply to Post #26
when you first worked on your nut bait you made a point of saying no breadcrumb, and thats a nod to two very prolific purveyors
when you first worked on your nut bait you made a point of saying no breadcrumb, and thats a nod to two very prolific purveyors
In reply to Post #25
No, I just don't have a filter so will say what usually gets said behind closed doors. plus, some of us are privy to info others aren't.
Again, never called hydra k a bad bait just called the krill superior based on ingredients used.
No, I just don't have a filter so will say what usually gets said behind closed doors. plus, some of us are privy to info others aren't.
Again, never called hydra k a bad bait just called the krill superior based on ingredients used.
In reply to Post #41
Unless you've worked with baits, seen what each individual ingredient does in a mix, utilised its individual properties, etc, etc.
Mozzi, I like that explanation a lot.
Perfectly sums up many a bait rollers disaster and success.
As someone once said to me, don't put any ingredient in a bait without purpose, and put it in there in a decent amount to make a difference, otherwise what is the point?
Unless you've worked with baits, seen what each individual ingredient does in a mix, utilised its individual properties, etc, etc.
Mozzi, I like that explanation a lot.
Perfectly sums up many a bait rollers disaster and success.
As someone once said to me, don't put any ingredient in a bait without purpose, and put it in there in a decent amount to make a difference, otherwise what is the point?
In reply to Post #40
If it was the case of mainline and sticky being able to produce the same standard of bait that would cost a home roller or smaller company £11 quid to produce why have my results never indicated that?. Since paying more for my bait my results have been night and day compared to when I was paying £6 quid a kilo. Obviously you need to pick your company very closely as paying more does not always equal a better bait from SOME companies. But it certainly does from others.
If it was the case of mainline and sticky being able to produce the same standard of bait that would cost a home roller or smaller company £11 quid to produce why have my results never indicated that?. Since paying more for my bait my results have been night and day compared to when I was paying £6 quid a kilo. Obviously you need to pick your company very closely as paying more does not always equal a better bait from SOME companies. But it certainly does from others.
In reply to Post #44
Exactly!
I've seen “fishmeal” boilies that have virtually none it just a flavour, dye and maybe 5/10% fishmeal which I don't get, it's cutting corners on an ingredient that's circa 2 quid a kilo! ( obviously pdfm and crustacean meals are more ).
One of the worst offenders I've seen is a maize and white crumb bait with a fist full of tigernut flour in it, I mean, it'll catch fish but it's not a nut bait!
Exactly!
I've seen “fishmeal” boilies that have virtually none it just a flavour, dye and maybe 5/10% fishmeal which I don't get, it's cutting corners on an ingredient that's circa 2 quid a kilo! ( obviously pdfm and crustacean meals are more ).
One of the worst offenders I've seen is a maize and white crumb bait with a fist full of tigernut flour in it, I mean, it'll catch fish but it's not a nut bait!
In reply to Post #45
It's totally dependant on the company, there are a LOT of rollers out there who made a 4 egg batch once, and saw it was easy money to make sh1te bait that rolls a dream. It's the equivalent of a Lego aficionado building your house ( alright an extreme example ).
The thing that surprises me is when people struggle to catch on bait. It's very very hard to make a bait that fish won't eat atleast once.
It's totally dependant on the company, there are a LOT of rollers out there who made a 4 egg batch once, and saw it was easy money to make sh1te bait that rolls a dream. It's the equivalent of a Lego aficionado building your house ( alright an extreme example ).
The thing that surprises me is when people struggle to catch on bait. It's very very hard to make a bait that fish won't eat atleast once.
In reply to Post #45
I would say that the bait you were using was not a good bait. I found the exact opposite when switching from big brands to a smaller company.
More realistic though is that the fish were feeding where your bait was at a specific time. Fishing has too many variables to say “the bait is the reason”. Without underwater recording 24/7 you will never know the half of it. You could have a rig on a spot for 48hrs and not catch, swap hookbaits and catch within 5 minutes. You'd say it was the bait but was it really just that the fish were not there and turned up 5 minutes after you recast? Or they were there and the weather changed and triggered a feed or that the fish that were there weren't interested and a different one arrived and was?
To simply say it's down to bait is wild imo. Did you become a better angler in that time, change venues, when did you use one and then change? Winter? Summer? Did you figure a venue out and learn the better spots to fish... endless list of other variables.
Irony of it all is, we spend our time trying to find a spot that the fish are happy to feed on naturally, we put bait on it and say it was The bait that caught the fish. But they were already feeding there anyway..? We just added extra food for them. It's like someone putting a poisoned steak out for you, you get home and there it is sitting on your normal plate waiting for you, you'd assume it's your dinner. If it's sitting on the sofa, no plate, you'd question what was going on wouldnt you?
I would say that the bait you were using was not a good bait. I found the exact opposite when switching from big brands to a smaller company.
More realistic though is that the fish were feeding where your bait was at a specific time. Fishing has too many variables to say “the bait is the reason”. Without underwater recording 24/7 you will never know the half of it. You could have a rig on a spot for 48hrs and not catch, swap hookbaits and catch within 5 minutes. You'd say it was the bait but was it really just that the fish were not there and turned up 5 minutes after you recast? Or they were there and the weather changed and triggered a feed or that the fish that were there weren't interested and a different one arrived and was?
To simply say it's down to bait is wild imo. Did you become a better angler in that time, change venues, when did you use one and then change? Winter? Summer? Did you figure a venue out and learn the better spots to fish... endless list of other variables.
Irony of it all is, we spend our time trying to find a spot that the fish are happy to feed on naturally, we put bait on it and say it was The bait that caught the fish. But they were already feeding there anyway..? We just added extra food for them. It's like someone putting a poisoned steak out for you, you get home and there it is sitting on your normal plate waiting for you, you'd assume it's your dinner. If it's sitting on the sofa, no plate, you'd question what was going on wouldnt you?
In reply to Post #48
I completely agree fishing has many variables. The bait I was using was a mainstream bait from one of the biggest companies about. Nothing changed in terms of approach rig and spot wise. I did have a better understanding of the lake naturally after spending time there. It was 100 percent the bait of that I have no doubt it was obvious to me. You will say it's bullshi1t and it could of been this that and the other but my findings where an expensive bait was streets ahead in terms of my results. It went from catching 1 every few trips of that to catching 2 a session. If your happy paying 6 quid for your bait that's brilliant I don't need to convince you otherwise, I was just stating that paying for what I consider to be a premium bait has completely changed my fishing and I wouldn't go back.
I completely agree fishing has many variables. The bait I was using was a mainstream bait from one of the biggest companies about. Nothing changed in terms of approach rig and spot wise. I did have a better understanding of the lake naturally after spending time there. It was 100 percent the bait of that I have no doubt it was obvious to me. You will say it's bullshi1t and it could of been this that and the other but my findings where an expensive bait was streets ahead in terms of my results. It went from catching 1 every few trips of that to catching 2 a session. If your happy paying 6 quid for your bait that's brilliant I don't need to convince you otherwise, I was just stating that paying for what I consider to be a premium bait has completely changed my fishing and I wouldn't go back.
In reply to Post #43
No, I just don't have a filter so will say what usually gets said behind closed doors. plus, some of us are privy to info others aren't.
You seem to have a filter when it comes to naming the recipes......
Surely the best BAIT is the one that catches the most fish, not necessarily the one that is the most complete food source? Remember when lakes were getting turned over on simple bird foods against people fishing full on proper milks? The ish just preferred eating them, and were able to eat loads. That's a better bait.
No, I just don't have a filter so will say what usually gets said behind closed doors. plus, some of us are privy to info others aren't.
You seem to have a filter when it comes to naming the recipes......
Surely the best BAIT is the one that catches the most fish, not necessarily the one that is the most complete food source? Remember when lakes were getting turned over on simple bird foods against people fishing full on proper milks? The ish just preferred eating them, and were able to eat loads. That's a better bait.
In reply to Post #49
I would love to know what companies you are referring to and the bait, this is an open forum, if we were talking about bad bedchairs we would be happy to state which one gave a bad back.
I would love to know what companies you are referring to and the bait, this is an open forum, if we were talking about bad bedchairs we would be happy to state which one gave a bad back.
In reply to Post #51
I could name the baits but then you just get accused of plugging certain companies and it never ends well.
I could name the baits but then you just get accused of plugging certain companies and it never ends well.
In reply to Post #51
Unless someone is prepared to name and praise, or name and shame then there is no point in posting. "I could tell you, but I won't". Winds me right up. If you're not prepared to tell all. Keep it to yourself.
Unless someone is prepared to name and praise, or name and shame then there is no point in posting. "I could tell you, but I won't". Winds me right up. If you're not prepared to tell all. Keep it to yourself.
In reply to Post #53
Jesus Christ your like an angry mob the bait I currently use is Rollinbaits optimum.
Jesus Christ your like an angry mob the bait I currently use is Rollinbaits optimum.
In reply to Post #54
Thanks. I'm sure it's a good bait, I have considered buying it myself, and still might.
Thanks. I'm sure it's a good bait, I have considered buying it myself, and still might.
In reply to Post #50
Surely the best BAIT is the one that catches the most fish, not necessarily the one that is the most complete food source? Remember when lakes were getting turned over on simple bird foods against people fishing full on proper milks
Amen to that! i hontesly believe a carp does not pick its food based on its nutritional content - i used to because that what i always read about and people told me. I dont anymore
Surely the best BAIT is the one that catches the most fish, not necessarily the one that is the most complete food source? Remember when lakes were getting turned over on simple bird foods against people fishing full on proper milks
Amen to that! i hontesly believe a carp does not pick its food based on its nutritional content - i used to because that what i always read about and people told me. I dont anymore
In reply to Post #54
Are the associated hook baits a necessity with the optimum?
Are the associated hook baits a necessity with the optimum?
In reply to Post #57
I've just got some optimum and first impressions is its a very soft bait and defo a high quality bait. They will go extremely soft within 12 hours and even with shrink wrap around the bait it expands from wherever it can due to the high amounts of soluble ingredients and you can literally push it together like paste.
I'm normally not a fan of hard hookbaits but I've just put in an order for some. If you need bottom bait hard hookers give them a call cos there not on the website yet
I've just got some optimum and first impressions is its a very soft bait and defo a high quality bait. They will go extremely soft within 12 hours and even with shrink wrap around the bait it expands from wherever it can due to the high amounts of soluble ingredients and you can literally push it together like paste.
I'm normally not a fan of hard hookbaits but I've just put in an order for some. If you need bottom bait hard hookers give them a call cos there not on the website yet
In reply to Post #58
I thought I saw some wafters on there?
I thought I saw some wafters on there?
In reply to Post #59
Yeah they do wafters on the website but if you want bottom bait hard hookers then you have to give them a call
Yeah they do wafters on the website but if you want bottom bait hard hookers then you have to give them a call
In reply to Post #58
Does optimum it contain a flavour? Is it mainly milk based?
Does optimum it contain a flavour? Is it mainly milk based?
In reply to Post #6
I would love to know how owning a small bait firm gives you the knowledge to know exactly the make up of Sticky and ABS bait, is there some bait company convention we don't know about where all the companies share their recipes with the smaller bait firms of this world? Or do you have a pass to wander round the factory floor whenever you like? I'm genuinely interested on how you can speak with such authority on what goes into other companies baits.
I would love to know how owning a small bait firm gives you the knowledge to know exactly the make up of Sticky and ABS bait, is there some bait company convention we don't know about where all the companies share their recipes with the smaller bait firms of this world? Or do you have a pass to wander round the factory floor whenever you like? I'm genuinely interested on how you can speak with such authority on what goes into other companies baits.
In reply to Post #61
Personally i would say it has a high milk protein content in it but there is a element of fishmeal to it. A few years ago I was told there is high amounts of Predigested fishmeal in it as well as high amounts of milk protein. Flavour wise is a bit hard to explain as its not over bearing and i've defo smelt it before but can't put my finger on it but after eating a few I can tell you it tastes like creamy caramel with a slight sort of digestive biscuit taste to it but then you get a rush of fish then you get the caramel sort of taste back in your mouth. It also doesn't seem to take on the smell of silt which i find works well on the lakes i fish. Texture wise its very soft and crumbles up nice and you can literally push it back together like a paste.
Also I would like to add they come across as a very good company to deal with cos when I rang them the other day to get some hard bottom baits off them he said he would personally roll them and get them out to me asap.
Hope this helps
Personally i would say it has a high milk protein content in it but there is a element of fishmeal to it. A few years ago I was told there is high amounts of Predigested fishmeal in it as well as high amounts of milk protein. Flavour wise is a bit hard to explain as its not over bearing and i've defo smelt it before but can't put my finger on it but after eating a few I can tell you it tastes like creamy caramel with a slight sort of digestive biscuit taste to it but then you get a rush of fish then you get the caramel sort of taste back in your mouth. It also doesn't seem to take on the smell of silt which i find works well on the lakes i fish. Texture wise its very soft and crumbles up nice and you can literally push it back together like a paste.
Also I would like to add they come across as a very good company to deal with cos when I rang them the other day to get some hard bottom baits off them he said he would personally roll them and get them out to me asap.
Hope this helps
In reply to Post #62
😂
😂
In reply to Post #64
What bait company do you run Mozzi? Pm if you prefer
What bait company do you run Mozzi? Pm if you prefer
In reply to Post #65
Look up Spectrum Baits on FB,
Look up Spectrum Baits on FB,
In reply to Post #61
No artificial flavours 👍🏼.
No artificial flavours 👍🏼.
In reply to Post #64
Very grown up response I must say, that only strengthens my belief you are full of rubbish, no wonder your credibility is falling lower and lower every passing day. Its a good job you don't rely on forums and social media to sell bait isn't it really....
Very grown up response I must say, that only strengthens my belief you are full of rubbish, no wonder your credibility is falling lower and lower every passing day. Its a good job you don't rely on forums and social media to sell bait isn't it really....
In reply to Post #67
Thanks mate
Thanks mate
In reply to Post #1
Which water may be able to shed some light
Which water may be able to shed some light
In reply to Post #70
I read through this thread like one would walk through a minefield , with severe trepidation.
Surely being in the right place is the single most important factor in carp fishing.?
I read through this thread like one would walk through a minefield , with severe trepidation.
Surely being in the right place is the single most important factor in carp fishing.?
In reply to Post #71
Yep.
But this the bait section, so people will probably want to discuss bait.
Yep.
But this the bait section, so people will probably want to discuss bait.
In reply to Post #72
True
True
In reply to Post #64
Mozzi you talk a lot of sense. But I would like to know one thing. I worked for Geoff at ABS for over 12 years. I was in charge of everything being the general manager. I dealt with all the bait companies supplied by ABS and was partly responsible for the development of Hydra-K. Now no offence but I have never heard of you or your bait company so how on earth can you possibly claim to know what is in Hydra-K? You may think you know and you are obviously very knowledgable about bait and its make up and can probably guess but sorry you do not really know. So just be honest and respect people on here.
Mozzi you talk a lot of sense. But I would like to know one thing. I worked for Geoff at ABS for over 12 years. I was in charge of everything being the general manager. I dealt with all the bait companies supplied by ABS and was partly responsible for the development of Hydra-K. Now no offence but I have never heard of you or your bait company so how on earth can you possibly claim to know what is in Hydra-K? You may think you know and you are obviously very knowledgable about bait and its make up and can probably guess but sorry you do not really know. So just be honest and respect people on here.
In reply to Post #74
Mic drop
Mic drop
In reply to Post #74
Again, not called hydra K a bad bait, I've said sticky's krill, by pure virtue of ingredients, in superior.
Even if I hadn't been told what goes into hydra K, I've seen it on the bank, tasted it, seen a sample of the basemix from someone, same with the krill, zero comparison.
It's no great shame to be beaten by people with superior access to ingredients and machinery, especially when rolling to a cost.
I must of had a dozen people message me over Facebook who phantom read these forums who've echoed these thoughts, three of them know their bait very well.
Again, not called hydra K a bad bait, I've said sticky's krill, by pure virtue of ingredients, in superior.
Even if I hadn't been told what goes into hydra K, I've seen it on the bank, tasted it, seen a sample of the basemix from someone, same with the krill, zero comparison.
It's no great shame to be beaten by people with superior access to ingredients and machinery, especially when rolling to a cost.
I must of had a dozen people message me over Facebook who phantom read these forums who've echoed these thoughts, three of them know their bait very well.
In reply to Post #76
You disrespectful sod
Just because you class a bait below another doesn't make it so.
*Nice edit Mozzi
You disrespectful sod
Just because you class a bait below another doesn't make it so.
*Nice edit Mozzi
In reply to Post #76
You really are something else. So it's gone from having nutritional info showing the bait is inferior (that you wouldnt share surprisingly) to I've seen it on the bank and tasted it a bit and didn't seem to be as good.
You really need to be careful bad mouthing these companies to sound clever with little or nothing to back it up, it doesn't do you or your companies reputation any good at all.
You really are something else. So it's gone from having nutritional info showing the bait is inferior (that you wouldnt share surprisingly) to I've seen it on the bank and tasted it a bit and didn't seem to be as good.
You really need to be careful bad mouthing these companies to sound clever with little or nothing to back it up, it doesn't do you or your companies reputation any good at all.
In reply to Post #78
what company even is it??
what company even is it??
In reply to Post #78
Who is the company he works for?
Who is the company he works for?
In reply to Post #79
Not read all of this thread then?
Not read all of this thread then?
In reply to Post #78
Not at all, in addendum lol.
Ive refrained from commenting further on this thread it's someone else who brought it back up weeks later.
Not at all, in addendum lol.
Ive refrained from commenting further on this thread it's someone else who brought it back up weeks later.
In reply to Post #76
Funny how all of the questions, praise and thanks you are getting for being such a knowledgeable bait brain come to you in private.
Have you managed to substantiate a single statement you have made about other companies bait with any facts?
For somebody who claims to discuss bait, share ideas and work with so many people in the bait industry it seems strange that not one single person seems willing to publicly acknowledge your existence.
Funny how all of the questions, praise and thanks you are getting for being such a knowledgeable bait brain come to you in private.
Have you managed to substantiate a single statement you have made about other companies bait with any facts?
For somebody who claims to discuss bait, share ideas and work with so many people in the bait industry it seems strange that not one single person seems willing to publicly acknowledge your existence.
In reply to Post #83
Look at “online members” at the top then “guests” lol. No ones going to sign up an account on here just to message me when I in fact use my real name on my profile
I'm find with a small forum not knowing who I am, I don't need it to, Ive lost zero customers through here.
Here's the thing, I get told stuff by people, exactly because I don't name drop lol. Ive known two people who worked at ABS, and one of their well known anglers, that and the fact I've handled the basemixes when I've had customers ask me to roll them, you get a very good idea of what's in them and if that matches accurately what you've been told is it in it gives the assertion substance. Ive rolled what was sent to me sledging to be the MC nut / half the small firms nut baits recipe and rolled it alongside some legitimate basemix and it's been identical, hence my particular disdains for that particular mix. BUT as I've said hydra K isn't a bad bait. It's just not as good as sticky.
Thing is if ANYONE else mentioned that comparison you'd 100% not pick up on it. As has happened many times in the past on this forum.
Now please, refrain from trying to stoke an old fire on what was a dead thread JUST because I'm replying to someone who made a post directed towards me.
Look at “online members” at the top then “guests” lol. No ones going to sign up an account on here just to message me when I in fact use my real name on my profile
I'm find with a small forum not knowing who I am, I don't need it to, Ive lost zero customers through here.
Here's the thing, I get told stuff by people, exactly because I don't name drop lol. Ive known two people who worked at ABS, and one of their well known anglers, that and the fact I've handled the basemixes when I've had customers ask me to roll them, you get a very good idea of what's in them and if that matches accurately what you've been told is it in it gives the assertion substance. Ive rolled what was sent to me sledging to be the MC nut / half the small firms nut baits recipe and rolled it alongside some legitimate basemix and it's been identical, hence my particular disdains for that particular mix. BUT as I've said hydra K isn't a bad bait. It's just not as good as sticky.
Thing is if ANYONE else mentioned that comparison you'd 100% not pick up on it. As has happened many times in the past on this forum.
Now please, refrain from trying to stoke an old fire on what was a dead thread JUST because I'm replying to someone who made a post directed towards me.
In reply to Post #84
Other forum members give their comparisons on different baits based on their opinion. I'm not going to comment on somebody else's opinion as they are entitled to it.
You make your statement as fact that one bait is 'superior' to the other, but have no evidence for the fact. Ever. Not once.
Nobody knows who you are, yet you know everybody else. Bit weird.
I don't doubt that you know a thing or two about making bait, it's fish food not rocket science. I'm just calling out the BS that you can't help but peddle about how you know the inner workings of other bait firms and their recipes.
I'm as bored as I'm sure you are of having the same back and forth, so we'll leave it there.
Other forum members give their comparisons on different baits based on their opinion. I'm not going to comment on somebody else's opinion as they are entitled to it.
You make your statement as fact that one bait is 'superior' to the other, but have no evidence for the fact. Ever. Not once.
Nobody knows who you are, yet you know everybody else. Bit weird.
I don't doubt that you know a thing or two about making bait, it's fish food not rocket science. I'm just calling out the BS that you can't help but peddle about how you know the inner workings of other bait firms and their recipes.
I'm as bored as I'm sure you are of having the same back and forth, so we'll leave it there.
In reply to Post #85
So why comment and prolong it?
Thing is most on this forum don't have the access ive been lucky to have, and as I said if another forum member stated it exactly the same you'd leave it.
As for it being bull, I've explained in other threads it's one thing knowing krill is better than hydra K it's quite another to post ingredients lists / approx quantities. In my opinion
So why comment and prolong it?
Thing is most on this forum don't have the access ive been lucky to have, and as I said if another forum member stated it exactly the same you'd leave it.
As for it being bull, I've explained in other threads it's one thing knowing krill is better than hydra K it's quite another to post ingredients lists / approx quantities. In my opinion
In reply to Post #81
My bad.
Googled it. Found a boat company. Went on Facebook... barely found it.
My bad.
Googled it. Found a boat company. Went on Facebook... barely found it.
In reply to Post #87
Stated many times I don't use facebook reliably for my company, stop trying to troll lol.
Stated many times I don't use facebook reliably for my company, stop trying to troll lol.
In reply to Post #88
just stating a fact. You seem to have no website and dont use facebook to promote business.
Just out of interest, how do you attract business without using the two largest marketing tools available?
just stating a fact. You seem to have no website and dont use facebook to promote business.
Just out of interest, how do you attract business without using the two largest marketing tools available?
In reply to Post #85
I know him.
He got me some hard to find ingredient years ago.
Very helpful fella with a lot of knowledge.
I know him.
He got me some hard to find ingredient years ago.
Very helpful fella with a lot of knowledge.
In reply to Post #89
how do you attract business without using the two largest marketing tools available?
I dont know about attracting business but he certainly uses the forum well to upset a few of the other bait rollers, I've seen a few come on to the forum who usually dont post on here to put him straight on a few things here and there, lets hope he doesn't upset mainline too much or Arkwell Foley and Steve M might send someone round to visit.
Anyone who can tell everything that's in a basemix by looking at it and running it through their hands possibly having a little taste is another level in my book "Jason Bourne level"
how do you attract business without using the two largest marketing tools available?
I dont know about attracting business but he certainly uses the forum well to upset a few of the other bait rollers, I've seen a few come on to the forum who usually dont post on here to put him straight on a few things here and there, lets hope he doesn't upset mainline too much or Arkwell Foley and Steve M might send someone round to visit.
Anyone who can tell everything that's in a basemix by looking at it and running it through their hands possibly having a little taste is another level in my book "Jason Bourne level"
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