In reply to Post #30
Sorry, had a straw that broke the camels back moment. Combination of a bad day and a touch of vino veritas. Sometimes you just need to unload .
Sorry, had a straw that broke the camels back moment. Combination of a bad day and a touch of vino veritas. Sometimes you just need to unload .
I can understand all the concern about this report , and whether or not we should ( or should not ) be using "carp care" products at all .
However , to my mind the testing that has been done is , in a way , totally useless. Surely the only way to be sure as to whether or not these products are effective is to have two groups of damaged fish ( and it needs to be the same type of damage in both groups ) all in the one tank/pool , and for one group to be treated , the other not .
Maybe I'm being a bit simplistic .......
However , to my mind the testing that has been done is , in a way , totally useless. Surely the only way to be sure as to whether or not these products are effective is to have two groups of damaged fish ( and it needs to be the same type of damage in both groups ) all in the one tank/pool , and for one group to be treated , the other not .
Maybe I'm being a bit simplistic .......
In reply to Post #32
Or it could be replicated and see what happens 4/5 times.
Or it could be replicated and see what happens 4/5 times.
I treat my koi and the carp I catch exactly the same
I use products from kusuri to clean and disinfect the wound they treat accordingly
I then use propolis to seal over the top I don’t use it to treat the wound itself
I use products from kusuri to clean and disinfect the wound they treat accordingly
I then use propolis to seal over the top I don’t use it to treat the wound itself
In reply to Post #35
Does it work on your Koi?
Does it work on your Koi?
In reply to Post #36
I'm not sure it's that easy to qualify, as has been proven fish get better themselves. I used to use NT Labs for my Koi, did they get better, yes, was it because of the NTL, who can tell, but I acted in what I thought were the fishes best interests.
Can these products be of benefit to fish in small ponds where stress may also be a factor maybe with a strained immune system where they won't heal as fast as in a normal environment, probably, but again needs evidence.
Not sure if I'm repeating myself here, can't be bothered to read the whole thread again, but I mentioned on the forum probably a decade back that I treated a aquarium fish with propolis and the site of application became a hole about the size of a pea. That would fit in with the findings of necrosis iirc from the tests but again hard to qualify.
I'm not sure it's that easy to qualify, as has been proven fish get better themselves. I used to use NT Labs for my Koi, did they get better, yes, was it because of the NTL, who can tell, but I acted in what I thought were the fishes best interests.
Can these products be of benefit to fish in small ponds where stress may also be a factor maybe with a strained immune system where they won't heal as fast as in a normal environment, probably, but again needs evidence.
Not sure if I'm repeating myself here, can't be bothered to read the whole thread again, but I mentioned on the forum probably a decade back that I treated a aquarium fish with propolis and the site of application became a hole about the size of a pea. That would fit in with the findings of necrosis iirc from the tests but again hard to qualify.