In reply to Post #16
The warmer surface layer is pushed to the downfind end and this water will hold less O2. The water will be saturated in O2 but simply hold less PPM due to its higher temperature. So, they cannot be fulfilling any O2 need by following summer winds.
The warmer surface layer is pushed to the downfind end and this water will hold less O2. The water will be saturated in O2 but simply hold less PPM due to its higher temperature. So, they cannot be fulfilling any O2 need by following summer winds.
In reply to Post #16
Been blowing SW for ages now I would be looking on the back of it or even somewhere along the middle. lake dependent really for me, small and weedy the wind makes no difference imo the weed acts like underwater walls slowing the tow. I think summer yes get on it for the first 24 hours then start to move back off it almost following the undertow as it builds as that's where the naturals get dragged after the initial "stir up". winter though, cant get my head around why they would get on and stay on a big cold wind, I know they sometimes do but for them to stay on a big wind with big undertow they have to use energy as the water has movement, kind of like fish in a river ect but not quite on the same level.
Been blowing SW for ages now I would be looking on the back of it or even somewhere along the middle. lake dependent really for me, small and weedy the wind makes no difference imo the weed acts like underwater walls slowing the tow. I think summer yes get on it for the first 24 hours then start to move back off it almost following the undertow as it builds as that's where the naturals get dragged after the initial "stir up". winter though, cant get my head around why they would get on and stay on a big cold wind, I know they sometimes do but for them to stay on a big wind with big undertow they have to use energy as the water has movement, kind of like fish in a river ect but not quite on the same level.
In reply to Post #18
6 and two 3's imo mate, oxygen absorption takes place on the surface as it's agitated by winds so you'd think that would offset (to a degree) any low O2 content caused by water temps.
I have no doubt O2 plays some part in the phenomenon of carp following winds. They have to face any undertow to get the gills working effectively. But I don't think the wind (or the food) are the only reasons.
I don't think we need a reason tbh. Let's face it we've all seen exceptions to every rule. They're animals with a mind of their own. On the best waters I've fished they break the rules all the time. Keeps it interesting.
It can and does pay to observe every aspect of the conditions, but I'd still not set up in a swim based solely on that.
6 and two 3's imo mate, oxygen absorption takes place on the surface as it's agitated by winds so you'd think that would offset (to a degree) any low O2 content caused by water temps.
I have no doubt O2 plays some part in the phenomenon of carp following winds. They have to face any undertow to get the gills working effectively. But I don't think the wind (or the food) are the only reasons.
I don't think we need a reason tbh. Let's face it we've all seen exceptions to every rule. They're animals with a mind of their own. On the best waters I've fished they break the rules all the time. Keeps it interesting.
It can and does pay to observe every aspect of the conditions, but I'd still not set up in a swim based solely on that.
In reply to Post #19
Its simple physics. No need to 'muddy the waters'. They aint there for O2 that's for sure.
Its simple physics. No need to 'muddy the waters'. They aint there for O2 that's for sure.
In reply to Post #17
Hi Justin T
That theory would work if the lower water was 100% saturated with dissolved oxygen but that's highly unlikely.
Carp can tolerate low oxygen as we know but also enjoy higher levels. Nothing is set in stone with them but it's just another piece in the puzzle.
Hi Justin T
That theory would work if the lower water was 100% saturated with dissolved oxygen but that's highly unlikely.
Carp can tolerate low oxygen as we know but also enjoy higher levels. Nothing is set in stone with them but it's just another piece in the puzzle.
In reply to Post #21
Nope. In all but extremely unusual circumstances water is 100% saturated all of the time. It can hold just 2mm and be OK for tench or just 20pmm and be OK for trout.
Carp fishing doesnt have its own laws of physics.
Nope. In all but extremely unusual circumstances water is 100% saturated all of the time. It can hold just 2mm and be OK for tench or just 20pmm and be OK for trout.
Carp fishing doesnt have its own laws of physics.
In reply to Post #22
I wouldn't call morning on a weedy lake unusual. Oxygen would be lower then
I wouldn't call morning on a weedy lake unusual. Oxygen would be lower then
In reply to Post #23
Lower...than what?
Lower...than what?
In reply to Post #22
I don't get this statement at all.
I've seen reports from an Aquatic Scientist showing levels less that 100% oxygen saturation on more than one water and I don't believe these were extremely unusual circumstances.
I don't get this statement at all.
I've seen reports from an Aquatic Scientist showing levels less that 100% oxygen saturation on more than one water and I don't believe these were extremely unusual circumstances.
In reply to Post #25
Have found fish follow wind in about 13c or above. But that could be to do with water temp as well, 13c day in jan, will be different in March in regards to daylight and the effect that has on rising water temps.
But March , 13c+ I'd get on it - if its a water that they generally follow the wind on.
Have found fish follow wind in about 13c or above. But that could be to do with water temp as well, 13c day in jan, will be different in March in regards to daylight and the effect that has on rising water temps.
But March , 13c+ I'd get on it - if its a water that they generally follow the wind on.
If the carp have followed the wind the past week, then the best place to look for them would be in the Baltic Sea near the shores of Finland.
In reply to Post #27
Carp locate to the downwind end of a lake not for oxygen or displaced inverts, but for increased temperatures.
I can prove this.
As a new wind springs up in the summer the warmer surface layer is pushed towards the downwind end, where is accumulates throughout the entire water column to the bed. We all know to be on the end of a new warm wind because the fish are there and feeding. As the warmer surface layer is soon replaced by cooler layers and this is pushed to the downwind bank the warming effect diminishes and the fish move off. THAT'S why you need to drop everything and be waiting for them when a band new SW fires up, especially on weed free large lakes and gravel pits.
They aint there for O2, in fact there is less O2, they are there because it is warmer.
Carp locate to the downwind end of a lake not for oxygen or displaced inverts, but for increased temperatures.
I can prove this.
As a new wind springs up in the summer the warmer surface layer is pushed towards the downwind end, where is accumulates throughout the entire water column to the bed. We all know to be on the end of a new warm wind because the fish are there and feeding. As the warmer surface layer is soon replaced by cooler layers and this is pushed to the downwind bank the warming effect diminishes and the fish move off. THAT'S why you need to drop everything and be waiting for them when a band new SW fires up, especially on weed free large lakes and gravel pits.
They aint there for O2, in fact there is less O2, they are there because it is warmer.
In reply to Post #24
Dissolved oxygen would be lower than its maximum saturation point at a given temperature.
Animal life in the lake use oxygen day or night, plants also take it in at night (respiration) so at the end of the night the oxygen levels would be depleted to some extent.
Dissolved oxygen would be lower than its maximum saturation point at a given temperature.
Animal life in the lake use oxygen day or night, plants also take it in at night (respiration) so at the end of the night the oxygen levels would be depleted to some extent.
In reply to Post #29
Air pressure is around 15lbs per square inch. Oxygen is replenished as quickly as it is used up and conversely is blown off almost as quickly.
A friend once described the country being full of barn owls. This obviously didnt mean they were everywhere, it meant that there were as many as the available environment could hold. The same relationship exists with water and O2. Water is, for the purpose of this thread, saturated with O2 most of the time. For the purpose of this thread, it holds less o2 at higher temperatures than it does at lower temperatures, with it holding the most o2 at 4oC.
Air pressure is around 15lbs per square inch. Oxygen is replenished as quickly as it is used up and conversely is blown off almost as quickly.
A friend once described the country being full of barn owls. This obviously didnt mean they were everywhere, it meant that there were as many as the available environment could hold. The same relationship exists with water and O2. Water is, for the purpose of this thread, saturated with O2 most of the time. For the purpose of this thread, it holds less o2 at higher temperatures than it does at lower temperatures, with it holding the most o2 at 4oC.
In reply to Post #28
Out of interest if we see very high summer temperatures with high water temperatures and the carp are sitting gasping are you suggesting that when a new wind springs up the carp head on down to the windward end for even warmer & less oxygenated water?
Out of interest if we see very high summer temperatures with high water temperatures and the carp are sitting gasping are you suggesting that when a new wind springs up the carp head on down to the windward end for even warmer & less oxygenated water?