Some big guns deciding enough is enough
In reply to Post #1
Rats and sinking ship comes to mind....
Trying to save themselves. Too late. They had more than enough chances to step away from the compulsive liar.
Rats and sinking ship comes to mind....
Trying to save themselves. Too late. They had more than enough chances to step away from the compulsive liar.
In reply to Post #1
The office they held may be classes them as "big guns" but reality of character and achievement doesn't.
The Brexit purge's of the long term moderate Tory politicians that got them elected several times. With screams of traitor's, enemies of the state and treasonous remainers have left big guns thin on the ground in this shambolic set up run by a chancing charlatan.
Hoisted by their own petard springs to mind
The office they held may be classes them as "big guns" but reality of character and achievement doesn't.
The Brexit purge's of the long term moderate Tory politicians that got them elected several times. With screams of traitor's, enemies of the state and treasonous remainers have left big guns thin on the ground in this shambolic set up run by a chancing charlatan.
Hoisted by their own petard springs to mind
A senior Tory said two years ago " all the decent Tory MPs are gone. We have never had a worse Govt with a worse leader.
He promotes for loyalty . Like the mafia they like to.have dirt
On oneanother for insurance.
Competence doesn't enter into it.
He promotes for loyalty . Like the mafia they like to.have dirt
On oneanother for insurance.
Competence doesn't enter into it.
Would be a silly move attempting a coup. Sadly I can't see traditional Tory voters turning out to vote for a government led by a duo called Sunak and Javid. The slippery ****s were happy to stand by Boris through all the previous shenanigans, it's a bit late for morality now.
Can't see Labour capitalising on this with Mr miss an open goal and his **** for brains deputy.
We conquered the globe once upon a time, now we can't even form a government without con men, liars, rapists and nonces.
Can't see Labour capitalising on this with Mr miss an open goal and his **** for brains deputy.
We conquered the globe once upon a time, now we can't even form a government without con men, liars, rapists and nonces.
In reply to Post #5
Boris might think he can stay but I'll be surprised if he's still here this time next week, if not sooner.
Keir has become a Brexiter but could still fall foul of Beergate along with Angela.
Maybe voting Monster Raving Looney is the more sensible bet?
Oh well at least the Ukrainians think we are ok.
Boris might think he can stay but I'll be surprised if he's still here this time next week, if not sooner.
Keir has become a Brexiter but could still fall foul of Beergate along with Angela.
Maybe voting Monster Raving Looney is the more sensible bet?
Oh well at least the Ukrainians think we are ok.
In reply to Post #6
At least he stayed until the final whistle. Those jumping ship are the equivalent of your midfield walking off after 88 mins at 6-0 down and blaming those left on the pitch at the press conference.
At least he stayed until the final whistle. Those jumping ship are the equivalent of your midfield walking off after 88 mins at 6-0 down and blaming those left on the pitch at the press conference.
In reply to Post #5
We conquered the globe once upon a time, now we can't even form a government without con men, liars, rapists and nonces.
Well said
Not that these monkeys really interest me but it does have an influence on what happens in our country, what a shower of *****
There's the house of Lords, the ones born with a silver spoon in their mouths and the house of commoners who are as far from commoners as can be, I bet 70% of the ****ing **** houses have invested interests and that is so wrong, they should be completely unbiased, end of
And the one that gets me over the years is when they jump ship and we're a blue but now they are a red and vice versa, when you believe in something you believe in something because it's a passion, end of story, none of these ****s have any scruples, if they Jack then that's it, they should be gone for good
We conquered the globe once upon a time, now we can't even form a government without con men, liars, rapists and nonces.
Well said
Not that these monkeys really interest me but it does have an influence on what happens in our country, what a shower of *****
There's the house of Lords, the ones born with a silver spoon in their mouths and the house of commoners who are as far from commoners as can be, I bet 70% of the ****ing **** houses have invested interests and that is so wrong, they should be completely unbiased, end of
And the one that gets me over the years is when they jump ship and we're a blue but now they are a red and vice versa, when you believe in something you believe in something because it's a passion, end of story, none of these ****s have any scruples, if they Jack then that's it, they should be gone for good
The sooner Boris goes the better. We can then finally get a Thatcherite government to sort this country out. Come on Lizzy sort em out! 
In reply to Post #7
Is staying to the end a good thing then for the tories?
Is staying to the end a good thing then for the tories?
In reply to Post #10
Probably. Nothing gained in a bunch of chinless wonders disappearing into the shadows of a tax funded salary when they were all implicated in every scandal by association.. ****s are paid to better my childrens future; not fondle their peers and squander our money on needlessly paying people to stay at home, awarding hooky supply contracts and disregarding their own rules that some people were daft enough to follow.
Be a man, stay until the final whistle and applaud the loyal fans who didn't get off early to catch the empty train. I'm out of football analogies, the floor is Mal's
Probably. Nothing gained in a bunch of chinless wonders disappearing into the shadows of a tax funded salary when they were all implicated in every scandal by association.. ****s are paid to better my childrens future; not fondle their peers and squander our money on needlessly paying people to stay at home, awarding hooky supply contracts and disregarding their own rules that some people were daft enough to follow.
Be a man, stay until the final whistle and applaud the loyal fans who didn't get off early to catch the empty train. I'm out of football analogies, the floor is Mal's
In reply to Post #10
Johnson isn't known for pulling out early.
Johnson isn't known for pulling out early.
In reply to Post #11
So you think the best thing for your children is for Johnson to stay in power to the end??
So you think the best thing for your children is for Johnson to stay in power to the end??
In reply to Post #11
I told you all to vote Green but did you listen?
Those who have accepted new roles in his cabinet are proof that there's a supply of self serving, immoral and out of touch clowns to join his circus. Anyone with a shred of integrity would have condemned his actions a dozen times already.
Absolute sham of a government.
Let's see if Zahawi pushes through the teachers pay rise he was pushing for now he's got the wallet eh?
I told you all to vote Green but did you listen?
Those who have accepted new roles in his cabinet are proof that there's a supply of self serving, immoral and out of touch clowns to join his circus. Anyone with a shred of integrity would have condemned his actions a dozen times already.
Absolute sham of a government.
Let's see if Zahawi pushes through the teachers pay rise he was pushing for now he's got the wallet eh?
Will be a sad day if BJ leaves....... 
In reply to Post #13
I'm saying anybody involved in this government should accept some responsibility and fall on their swords with Boris. You asked the best thing for the Conservative party, not my kids.. the best thing for their party, as Mal almost alluded to, is not disappearing into a back office public funded position. Unless they want to continue with the image of a bunch of toffs who do as they please and still fleece the tax payer dry; it's worked this far I suppose.
Feel free to find something to disagree with mate, I'm sure you won't struggle
I'm saying anybody involved in this government should accept some responsibility and fall on their swords with Boris. You asked the best thing for the Conservative party, not my kids.. the best thing for their party, as Mal almost alluded to, is not disappearing into a back office public funded position. Unless they want to continue with the image of a bunch of toffs who do as they please and still fleece the tax payer dry; it's worked this far I suppose.
Feel free to find something to disagree with mate, I'm sure you won't struggle
Let us remember these people who are now resigning did not resign over 180,000 covid deaths, the £billions embezzled in dodgy PPE contracts, Russian oligarch money flooding the party, the routine breaking of both national and international law, the now obvious failure of Brexit, foodbanks as part of daily life for millions of working people, the trafficking of vulnerable refugees to concentration camps 4000 miles away, ‘Partygate', the erosion of our human rights and civil liberties etc etc.
They are resigning purely for their own self-interest. There are no ‘good Tories'. That rare breed all left or were purged prior to the 2019 election. This is just the same toxic scum re-solidifying in a slightly different location on the trough.
Everyone deserves better than this. We need a GE, and for whomever takes power (and Labour couldn't win a majority so will need to form a coalition) to enact an immediate overhaul of FPTP voting to ensure we never end up in a similar situation ever again.
They are resigning purely for their own self-interest. There are no ‘good Tories'. That rare breed all left or were purged prior to the 2019 election. This is just the same toxic scum re-solidifying in a slightly different location on the trough.
Everyone deserves better than this. We need a GE, and for whomever takes power (and Labour couldn't win a majority so will need to form a coalition) to enact an immediate overhaul of FPTP voting to ensure we never end up in a similar situation ever again.
In reply to Post #17
You made a typo there. You wrote there are no good "Tories". It's spelt politicians ....
You made a typo there. You wrote there are no good "Tories". It's spelt politicians ....
In reply to Post #18
I don't agree with you and you actually highlight a fundamental issue with politics in this country; not suggesting this is you but there are so many people out there who are not properly engaged enough to realise that not all politicians are the same, and worse, that some even think they're all as bad as the current Tory sh*tshow. They're fed utter nonsense from right wing media, dubiously funded "think tanks", and a load of other self-interested shady organisations and led to believe it is the truth. This forges a mindset that leads us inevitably into the precise situation that we're in now. If we collectively demand better from our politicians, then we can change the direction of travel. If we don't, then we go backwards.
I don't agree with you and you actually highlight a fundamental issue with politics in this country; not suggesting this is you but there are so many people out there who are not properly engaged enough to realise that not all politicians are the same, and worse, that some even think they're all as bad as the current Tory sh*tshow. They're fed utter nonsense from right wing media, dubiously funded "think tanks", and a load of other self-interested shady organisations and led to believe it is the truth. This forges a mindset that leads us inevitably into the precise situation that we're in now. If we collectively demand better from our politicians, then we can change the direction of travel. If we don't, then we go backwards.
In reply to Post #16
You want these people to better your children's future, but the resignations are suggesting that this cant be done under Johnsons control, whom you want to stay to the bitter end, just sounds abit illogical to me.
Think in part most of the country wants him gone, there are a couple of decent candidates waiting in the wings which should help the country quite a bit more than johnson has recently
You want these people to better your children's future, but the resignations are suggesting that this cant be done under Johnsons control, whom you want to stay to the bitter end, just sounds abit illogical to me.
Think in part most of the country wants him gone, there are a couple of decent candidates waiting in the wings which should help the country quite a bit more than johnson has recently
In reply to Post #19
Wasn't it the last labour government that sent us into a " war on terror" looking for "weapons of mass destruction" that didn't exist? Hardly a great example of how to lead the country. You actually highlight an issue that people on the left think that it's only Tories/right that are wronguns. At the end of the day they all make promises they can't keep. They all take our money in taxes and then waste it/give it to layabouts. They all play the system for their own benefit. And all whilst sitting happily in their subsidised bars in Westminster drinking their £1 pints and eating their £2 full English breakfasts and commenting on how the cost of living crisis affects us all equally
Wasn't it the last labour government that sent us into a " war on terror" looking for "weapons of mass destruction" that didn't exist? Hardly a great example of how to lead the country. You actually highlight an issue that people on the left think that it's only Tories/right that are wronguns. At the end of the day they all make promises they can't keep. They all take our money in taxes and then waste it/give it to layabouts. They all play the system for their own benefit. And all whilst sitting happily in their subsidised bars in Westminster drinking their £1 pints and eating their £2 full English breakfasts and commenting on how the cost of living crisis affects us all equally
In reply to Post #20
I didn't say I wanted to Johnson to stay at all. Not sure where you get that from.
There are no decent candidates waiting in the wings. They're all Murdoch / Rothermere stooges and will be equally as diabolical as Johnson.
I didn't say I wanted to Johnson to stay at all. Not sure where you get that from.
There are no decent candidates waiting in the wings. They're all Murdoch / Rothermere stooges and will be equally as diabolical as Johnson.
In reply to Post #21
The invasion of Iraq was a complete disaster, and Labour were hoodwinked and rode piggy back on Bush's shoulders with awful consequences, nobody in their right mind would deny that.
However, there's also no denying that after 12 years of Tory rule, we're all worse off, we have a cost of living crisis, we're on the verge of a breakdown of the peace process in N.I., all the while Tory MP's sexually assault, watch porn in the HOC, corruptly line their own pockets with our tax payers money, lie with impunity, and make the lives of millions of people absolutely miserable because of their neoliberal ideology.
I am not saying that we should have a Labour Govt; I am saying that we should, at all costs, get rid of this Tory one. I want a Govt. that's put in place through proportional representation, a system that never allows a single party to achieve un-contestable dominance as we have seen over the last several decades.
The invasion of Iraq was a complete disaster, and Labour were hoodwinked and rode piggy back on Bush's shoulders with awful consequences, nobody in their right mind would deny that.
However, there's also no denying that after 12 years of Tory rule, we're all worse off, we have a cost of living crisis, we're on the verge of a breakdown of the peace process in N.I., all the while Tory MP's sexually assault, watch porn in the HOC, corruptly line their own pockets with our tax payers money, lie with impunity, and make the lives of millions of people absolutely miserable because of their neoliberal ideology.
I am not saying that we should have a Labour Govt; I am saying that we should, at all costs, get rid of this Tory one. I want a Govt. that's put in place through proportional representation, a system that never allows a single party to achieve un-contestable dominance as we have seen over the last several decades.
In reply to Post #23
...and yes, I want £1 pints aswell.
...and yes, I want £1 pints aswell.
In reply to Post #24
Hoodwinked lol. They knew exactly what they were doing!
Me too although I wasn't allowed as was working. The breakfast is nothing to get excited about tbh
Hoodwinked lol. They knew exactly what they were doing!
Me too although I wasn't allowed as was working. The breakfast is nothing to get excited about tbh
In reply to Post #25
Yeah, but at the prices I'd take it!
Yeah, but at the prices I'd take it!
In reply to Post #22
I was replying to Noj 😃
I was replying to Noj 😃
In reply to Post #26
Having eaten one, I'd rather starve
Having eaten one, I'd rather starve
In reply to Post #27
Apologies.
Apologies.
In reply to Post #28
OK, point taken. To be honest, if I was headed there it would be with a barrel of gunpowder, not an expectation of a decent fry up.
OK, point taken. To be honest, if I was headed there it would be with a barrel of gunpowder, not an expectation of a decent fry up.
In reply to Post #30
Yeah I wasn't allowed that either .. although with the amount of booze in the place I doubt you'd need gunpowder to get the place lit up nicely
Yeah I wasn't allowed that either .. although with the amount of booze in the place I doubt you'd need gunpowder to get the place lit up nicely
36 MPs have quit their government jobs and called on the PM to resign so far:
Cabinet Ministers
Sajid Javid, Heath Secretary
Rishi Sunak, Chancellor
Ministers
Will Quince, Children's Minister
Robin Walker, Education Minister
John Glen, Economic Secretary to the Treasury and City Minister
Victoria Adkins, Home Office Minister
Jo Churchill, Environment Minister
Stuart Andrew, Housing Minister
Kemi Badenoch, Equalities Minister
Alex Burghart, Education Minister
Julia Lopez, Media Minister
Neil O'Brien, Levelling Up Minister
Lee Rowley, Industry Minister
Mims Davies, Employment Minister
Rachel Maclean, Minister for Safeguarding
Mike Freer, Minister for Exports and Minister for Equality
Parliamentary Private Secretary (PPS)
Jonathan Gullis, PPS Northern Ireland
Saqib Bhatti, PPS Health
Nicola Richards, PPS Transport
Virginia Crosbie, Wales PPS
Laura Trott, PPS Transport
Felicity Buchan, PPS Business
Claire Coutinho, PPS Treasury
David Johnston, PPS Education
Selaine Saxby, PPS Treasury
Mark Logan, PPS Northern Ireland
Craig Williams, PPS Treasury
Duncan Baker, PPS Levelling Up
Mark Fletcher, PPS Business
Sara Britcliffe, PPS Education
Ruth Edwards, PPS Scotland
Peter Gibson, Department for International Trade
Trade Envoys
Andrew Murrison, Trade Envoy Morocco
Theo Clarke, Kenya Envoy
Other roles
Alex Chalk, Solicitor General
Bim Afolami, Conservative Party Vice Chair
Cabinet Ministers
Sajid Javid, Heath Secretary
Rishi Sunak, Chancellor
Ministers
Will Quince, Children's Minister
Robin Walker, Education Minister
John Glen, Economic Secretary to the Treasury and City Minister
Victoria Adkins, Home Office Minister
Jo Churchill, Environment Minister
Stuart Andrew, Housing Minister
Kemi Badenoch, Equalities Minister
Alex Burghart, Education Minister
Julia Lopez, Media Minister
Neil O'Brien, Levelling Up Minister
Lee Rowley, Industry Minister
Mims Davies, Employment Minister
Rachel Maclean, Minister for Safeguarding
Mike Freer, Minister for Exports and Minister for Equality
Parliamentary Private Secretary (PPS)
Jonathan Gullis, PPS Northern Ireland
Saqib Bhatti, PPS Health
Nicola Richards, PPS Transport
Virginia Crosbie, Wales PPS
Laura Trott, PPS Transport
Felicity Buchan, PPS Business
Claire Coutinho, PPS Treasury
David Johnston, PPS Education
Selaine Saxby, PPS Treasury
Mark Logan, PPS Northern Ireland
Craig Williams, PPS Treasury
Duncan Baker, PPS Levelling Up
Mark Fletcher, PPS Business
Sara Britcliffe, PPS Education
Ruth Edwards, PPS Scotland
Peter Gibson, Department for International Trade
Trade Envoys
Andrew Murrison, Trade Envoy Morocco
Theo Clarke, Kenya Envoy
Other roles
Alex Chalk, Solicitor General
Bim Afolami, Conservative Party Vice Chair
In reply to Post #32
Every single last one of these have been washing their hands in a sewer for the past several years and only now are they complaining that they have sh*t on them. Self serving, moral-free cowards.
Anyway, looks like Johnson is toast.
GE incoming?
Every single last one of these have been washing their hands in a sewer for the past several years and only now are they complaining that they have sh*t on them. Self serving, moral-free cowards.
Anyway, looks like Johnson is toast.
GE incoming?
In reply to Post #33
I hope we never forget the catastrophic damage one man has done to this country. And for what? He had no vision, no political conviction. He just wanted to be Prime Minister and to heck with the consequences. Unforgivable
Propped up by a complicit Party and media. All for personal gain.
I hope we never forget the catastrophic damage one man has done to this country. And for what? He had no vision, no political conviction. He just wanted to be Prime Minister and to heck with the consequences. Unforgivable
Propped up by a complicit Party and media. All for personal gain.
In reply to Post #34
Indeed.
Also propped up by a gormless voter base and unsustainable FTPT system.
Indeed.
Also propped up by a gormless voter base and unsustainable FTPT system.
In reply to Post #35
If Boris goes do we then have either Sajid or Rishi waiting in the wings to take the job ?
If Boris goes do we then have either Sajid or Rishi waiting in the wings to take the job ?
In reply to Post #36
Hard to envisage given how racist the Tory Party has become.
Hard to envisage given how racist the Tory Party has become.
In reply to Post #36
Hard to envisage given how racist the Tory Party has become.
Hard to envisage given how racist the Tory Party has become.
In reply to Post #36
God I hope so. Imagine all the anti woke angry immigrant hating gammons
Having to make a choice between Take the Knee Starmer
Or a brown person.
God I hope so. Imagine all the anti woke angry immigrant hating gammons
Having to make a choice between Take the Knee Starmer
Or a brown person.
In reply to Post #39
Hopefully a huge chunk of the electorates heads will implode and we'll all be better off as a result.
Hopefully a huge chunk of the electorates heads will implode and we'll all be better off as a result.
In reply to Post #32
As said, too late to escape untarnished.
But if it forces the idiot out then its a start.
Even priti - 'i'm only still in my job because boris ignored the result of the inquiry into my bullying' - has turned on him. Wonder if that private jet drops off at Rwanda eh?
Gove too. And apparently Zahawi, a day after being made chancellor!
Disgraceful bunch of slugs the lot of them.
GE would be fun. Seeing them all suddenly throw him under a bus (with a £350 million lie painted on it) in order to try and save their own skins / salaries.
As said, too late to escape untarnished.
But if it forces the idiot out then its a start.
Even priti - 'i'm only still in my job because boris ignored the result of the inquiry into my bullying' - has turned on him. Wonder if that private jet drops off at Rwanda eh?
Gove too. And apparently Zahawi, a day after being made chancellor!
Disgraceful bunch of slugs the lot of them.
GE would be fun. Seeing them all suddenly throw him under a bus (with a £350 million lie painted on it) in order to try and save their own skins / salaries.
Jesus, what an absolute s##t show today has been, the bloke wont walk, now he sacks Gove
In reply to Post #42
He's gone full Hitler in a Bunker
He's gone full Hitler in a Bunker
In reply to Post #42
Every cloud....
Bloody hilarious. First time Gove says something sensible he gets sacked.
If Starmer can't score from this massive open goal then he really is useless....
Every cloud....
Bloody hilarious. First time Gove says something sensible he gets sacked.
If Starmer can't score from this massive open goal then he really is useless....
In reply to Post #44
Todays the day then
Todays the day then
Wonder who will take over......won't be for months anyway......
KS is a complete tool with as much baggage as BJ......
KS is a complete tool with as much baggage as BJ......
In reply to Post #46
Lizzy Truss. 👍
Lizzy Truss. 👍
In reply to Post #47
The choices must be thin on the ground when the Bloke from Stoke wants Truss. Member of the Staffordshire cheesemonger committee maybe
The choices must be thin on the ground when the Bloke from Stoke wants Truss. Member of the Staffordshire cheesemonger committee maybe
I would have thought the Bojo diehards like Truss,Raab and that pompous **** Rees-Mogg will have no chance of winning the contest.
In reply to Post #46
Starmer is a tool, but Johnson is in a different orbit.
However, as you know (?) Starmer can't just "take over" from Johnson.
Whoever it is - Truss, Raab, Baker ( ) - they will continue to destroy the party and continue the assurance that the Tories will be unelectable for a generation come the next GE.
Starmer is a tool, but Johnson is in a different orbit.
However, as you know (?) Starmer can't just "take over" from Johnson.
Whoever it is - Truss, Raab, Baker (
) - they will continue to destroy the party and continue the assurance that the Tories will be unelectable for a generation come the next GE.
Doesn't matter who you vote for, they all have their noses in the trough and will ALL follow the script their given by the corporate rulers!
Fuel prices will stay high......blame it on the Russians.
Energy prices will stay high.......blame it on CV and the Russians.
Food prices will stay high.......blame it on the Russians!
NHS no doctors......blame it on Brexit and BJ
All scripted bollox......
Fuel prices will stay high......blame it on the Russians.
Energy prices will stay high.......blame it on CV and the Russians.
Food prices will stay high.......blame it on the Russians!
NHS no doctors......blame it on Brexit and BJ
All scripted bollox......
In reply to Post #51
I refer the gentleman to my post 19
I refer the gentleman to my post 19
In reply to Post #51
That's why they worked so hard to vilify Jeremy Corbyn
He wasn't going to play their game and they have had
It all.their own way since the 60s. Terrified them. They still
Slag him off now.
That's why they worked so hard to vilify Jeremy Corbyn
He wasn't going to play their game and they have had
It all.their own way since the 60s. Terrified them. They still
Slag him off now.
In reply to Post #51
'Wise' words from Carpforum's very own Nadine Dorries.
'Wise' words from Carpforum's very own Nadine Dorries.
In reply to Post #51
there isnt one party nor MP that isnt full of lies
there isnt one party nor MP that isnt full of lies
In reply to Post #53
Agreed, Corbyn's heart was in the right place, he knew exactly what was going on, and that's what made him popular. I believe Lisa Nandy will also make a good candidate for the leader of the labour party
Agreed, Corbyn's heart was in the right place, he knew exactly what was going on, and that's what made him popular. I believe Lisa Nandy will also make a good candidate for the leader of the labour party
In reply to Post #55
I give you....Count Binface.
I give you....Count Binface.
In reply to Post #56
If Corbyn was popular why did he lose 60 seats in the GE?
If Corbyn was popular why did he lose 60 seats in the GE?
In reply to Post #58
Because the right-wing press made up a load of bull**** about him, and all the dimwits up-north who voted for Brexit had their pants pulled down.
Because the right-wing press made up a load of bull**** about him, and all the dimwits up-north who voted for Brexit had their pants pulled down.
In reply to Post #59
No folk don't need the press to give then an opinion on Corbyn he's an idiot and an attention seeker.
No folk don't need the press to give then an opinion on Corbyn he's an idiot and an attention seeker.
In reply to Post #59
So he wasn't popular then.
So he wasn't popular then.
We're increasingly given a choice of idiots to vote for. Johnson / the tories definitely got in on the coat tails of the xenophobia whipped up by farage and Co.
We're told that he 'got brexit done' - tell that to business owners or the people of Northern Ireland...
He has been a liar and buffoon for years. And those ministers who have supported him are as guilty in ruining things as he is.
The choice of replacements is so weak that it reflects how far standards have fallen.
We're told that he 'got brexit done' - tell that to business owners or the people of Northern Ireland...
He has been a liar and buffoon for years. And those ministers who have supported him are as guilty in ruining things as he is.
The choice of replacements is so weak that it reflects how far standards have fallen.
In reply to Post #60
Which does that make Johnson then?
Which does that make Johnson then?
In reply to Post #63
He's another tool.
He's another tool.
In reply to Post #59
Exactly that, I suspect a few on this thread fell hook line and sinker for the garbage that came out of the daily mail
Exactly that, I suspect a few on this thread fell hook line and sinker for the garbage that came out of the daily mail
In reply to Post #64
No, I would summarise it slightly differently and if we're going to do a direct comparison;
Johnson created the fascist Rwanda policy, oversaw the embezzlement of £bns of taxpayers money by MPs and party donors, the rank corruption, the cruelty, the endless rape/sex offences, the economic decline, the crashing £, the spiralling inflation, the covid death toll, the running down of the NHS, the breaking of international law, the foodbanks, the homeless dying in doorways at a rate of thousands a year etc etc etc. By any metric Johnson and the Conservative Party are a total clusterf***. Johnson and the Tory party are the reason the UK is now an absolute poop-stained dumpster fire and a laughingstock on the world stage. Today is the most Tory day in history. This is *exactly* what they are.
But Corbyn is an idiot and an attention seeker, eh!
No, I would summarise it slightly differently and if we're going to do a direct comparison;
Johnson created the fascist Rwanda policy, oversaw the embezzlement of £bns of taxpayers money by MPs and party donors, the rank corruption, the cruelty, the endless rape/sex offences, the economic decline, the crashing £, the spiralling inflation, the covid death toll, the running down of the NHS, the breaking of international law, the foodbanks, the homeless dying in doorways at a rate of thousands a year etc etc etc. By any metric Johnson and the Conservative Party are a total clusterf***. Johnson and the Tory party are the reason the UK is now an absolute poop-stained dumpster fire and a laughingstock on the world stage. Today is the most Tory day in history. This is *exactly* what they are.
But Corbyn is an idiot and an attention seeker, eh!
In reply to Post #66
Oh come on you can't blame politicians for the ups and downs of the economy, and most of the stuff you've jabbered on about.
I'm sure folk all over the world say similar of their elected leaders.
If the UK is really that bad why are you still here ?
Oh come on you can't blame politicians for the ups and downs of the economy, and most of the stuff you've jabbered on about.
I'm sure folk all over the world say similar of their elected leaders.
If the UK is really that bad why are you still here ?
Just catching up on the days events...
The man is pitiful. Trying to hang on in number 10 regardless of everything like some pathetic dumped ex pleading to 'still be friends '
No integrity, no morals, no empathy and even at the death no class. Worst prime minister ever. And I'm including Blair in that ....
The man is pitiful. Trying to hang on in number 10 regardless of everything like some pathetic dumped ex pleading to 'still be friends '
No integrity, no morals, no empathy and even at the death no class. Worst prime minister ever. And I'm including Blair in that ....
In reply to Post #67
OK, you want to excuse the government on the state of the economy.
What about all of the other stuff?
You're not doing a very good job of convincing me that all politicians are the same.
OK, you want to excuse the government on the state of the economy.
What about all of the other stuff?
You're not doing a very good job of convincing me that all politicians are the same.
In reply to Post #68
In reply to Post #70
I certainly view vast swathes of the electorate with a similar level of contempt! Who the actual f*ck votes for people like Liz Truss, Desmond Swayne, Michael Fabricant or Peter Bone? These people need their bloody heads examined.
I certainly view vast swathes of the electorate with a similar level of contempt! Who the actual f*ck votes for people like Liz Truss, Desmond Swayne, Michael Fabricant or Peter Bone? These people need their bloody heads examined.
In reply to Post #70
That's a very objective view noj.
Although... I've never been chancellor of Germany and I'm pretty sure Hitler was a ****....
That's a very objective view noj.
Although... I've never been chancellor of Germany and I'm pretty sure Hitler was a ****....
In reply to Post #69
Ooops, Minister for Brexit Opportunities, Jacob Rees-Mogg (aka "The Haunted Pencil") has just blamed ex-Tory Chancellor Rishi Sunak for the state of the economy.
Ooops, Minister for Brexit Opportunities, Jacob Rees-Mogg (aka "The Haunted Pencil") has just blamed ex-Tory Chancellor Rishi Sunak for the state of the economy.
In reply to Post #72
It's not cringeworthy if you have always hated them.
I admit that faacker was Gold. He was a Golden Goose. People that pay ZERO attention to Politics knew his name. And they thought he was more 'like them'.
He wasn't. He's not even like the vipers in the HOC.
He's like Trump, got everything all his life. And Zero consequences. As many affairs and kids and under age ****
As you like and you get off.
As.many lies and broken promises and bankruptcies. And you walk away.
BUT in this awful post Kardashian reality TV world
this is who America and GB decide to get behind.
OK
Fair enough. You have a winner. They are a ****ing psyco. You wouldn't have someone like that in your house. But they will win votes. Ok
Ok. I get that. But what about the actual ****ing country? Like, the one we live in.
Wouldn't sone boring old intelligent person be a better bet?
I admit that faacker was Gold. He was a Golden Goose. People that pay ZERO attention to Politics knew his name. And they thought he was more 'like them'.
He wasn't. He's not even like the vipers in the HOC.
He's like Trump, got everything all his life. And Zero consequences. As many affairs and kids and under age ****
As you like and you get off.
As.many lies and broken promises and bankruptcies. And you walk away.
BUT in this awful post Kardashian reality TV world
this is who America and GB decide to get behind.
OK
Fair enough. You have a winner. They are a ****ing psyco. You wouldn't have someone like that in your house. But they will win votes. Ok
Ok. I get that. But what about the actual ****ing country? Like, the one we live in.
Wouldn't sone boring old intelligent person be a better bet?
In reply to Post #75
In reply to Post #73
Of course he has...
He's probably one step away from blaming people being ill on sajid javid and the war in Ukraine on Ben Wallace
Of course he has...
He's probably one step away from blaming people being ill on sajid javid and the war in Ukraine on Ben Wallace
In reply to Post #76
Blimey mate. That is some amazing mental gymnastics.
I give it 10
Blimey mate. That is some amazing mental gymnastics.
I give it 10
In reply to Post #78
Two things I'm thinking
1 - he's resigned as tory party leader but not as PM. Which is a bit like when joey Barton 'retired from international football' .... a pointless gesture that actually doesn't change anything. The idiot doesn't see that nobody cares if he's leader of the tory party. It's his right royal **** up of leading the country that's the issue.
2 - and this is more concerning.... priti has been very quiet. ... like she's planning some nefarious scheme... like running for the bloody job!
Edit - leave means leave....
Get Bexit done
1 - he's resigned as tory party leader but not as PM. Which is a bit like when joey Barton 'retired from international football' .... a pointless gesture that actually doesn't change anything. The idiot doesn't see that nobody cares if he's leader of the tory party. It's his right royal **** up of leading the country that's the issue.
2 - and this is more concerning.... priti has been very quiet. ... like she's planning some nefarious scheme... like running for the bloody job!
Edit - leave means leave....
Get Bexit done
In reply to Post #79
I was just thinking that myself.
A small band of strong opinionated people who think their view is superior to someone else, while the rest of the forum, who also have an opinion but have seen it all before, can't be arsed and rather talk about fishing and argue about bait
I was just thinking that myself.
A small band of strong opinionated people who think their view is superior to someone else, while the rest of the forum, who also have an opinion but have seen it all before, can't be arsed and rather talk about fishing and argue about bait
In reply to Post #80
He continues as Prime minster even though he has resigned, he throws in the towel and all of a sudden it's wrapped around his face again
Touch of the Corbins there, know when you are beat, what a tit
I will tell you who will be in the running for that, sickly Sunak, who has got more invested interests and offshore interest than anybody, another bent ****. Mr ****ing charisma
What's the song, We're holding for a hero....
He continues as Prime minster even though he has resigned, he throws in the towel and all of a sudden it's wrapped around his face again
Touch of the Corbins there, know when you are beat, what a tit
I will tell you who will be in the running for that, sickly Sunak, who has got more invested interests and offshore interest than anybody, another bent ****. Mr ****ing charisma
What's the song, We're holding for a hero....
I bet our old friend spanky is still on the final stroke this morning after hearing BJ was resigning.......
So who do we think is going to rip up the script and be a prime minister for the people and the country......anyone......
So who do we think is going to rip up the script and be a prime minister for the people and the country......anyone......
In reply to Post #83
Perhaps we could elect someone from carp forum? Couldn't be any worse than what we have just endured.
Perhaps we could elect someone from carp forum? Couldn't be any worse than what we have just endured.
In reply to Post #84
I think I'll pass in that idea 😂
I think I'll pass in that idea 😂
In reply to Post #84
I'm sure we could do a far better job......can I be the health secretary please.......
I'm sure we could do a far better job......can I be the health secretary please.......
In reply to Post #81
Yes, if you're not a Labour voter you're not informed or educated according to these lot....comical
Yes, if you're not a Labour voter you're not informed or educated according to these lot....comical
Quite the rant from Jonathan Pie
https://youtu.be/lKrLBPmRsrM
https://youtu.be/lKrLBPmRsrM
In reply to Post #86
Yes you can, and ip100 is Nadine Dorries.
Yes you can, and ip100 is Nadine Dorries.
Looking at the mirror, page 7 the dunce off 
As I suspected, Sunak £730 million. Javid £8 million, Zahawi £100 million ( not an Afghan war lord at the moment that I am aware of anyway but sounds like one lol)
Mordaunt, Wallace and Truss on their arses, they will do for me lol
As I suspected, Sunak £730 million. Javid £8 million, Zahawi £100 million ( not an Afghan war lord at the moment that I am aware of anyway but sounds like one lol)
Mordaunt, Wallace and Truss on their arses, they will do for me lol
In reply to Post #88
His rants are absolutely brilliant
His rants are absolutely brilliant
In reply to Post #89
Pr1ck
Pr1ck
In reply to Post #92
Now now - I'd suggest that you take the comment in the spirit it was intended; it was a joke.
Now now - I'd suggest that you take the comment in the spirit it was intended; it was a joke.
In reply to Post #87
Not my opinion ip
However - if you're not a Green voter then....
Not my opinion ip
However - if you're not a Green voter then....
In reply to Post #93
Of course it was....
Of course it was....
In reply to Post #94
Wasn't referring to you mal, we all know your on the green side of things. Tbh they are probably the least of the evils. Hence they'll never be in power.
Wasn't referring to you mal, we all know your on the green side of things. Tbh they are probably the least of the evils. Hence they'll never be in power.
In reply to Post #95
It was!
We were talking about electing people from this forum into the cabinet!
It's not exactly serious is it?
Come on, it's Friday - you could have called me Diane Abbot.
It was!
We were talking about electing people from this forum into the cabinet!
It's not exactly serious is it?
Come on, it's Friday - you could have called me Diane Abbot.
In reply to Post #97
Except Diane Abbott probably doesn't know it's Friday....
Except Diane Abbott probably doesn't know it's Friday....
In reply to Post #98
I'm sure like me you are all worried about all those MPs that resigned. How will they manage?
I'm pleased to say they will be looked after.
LINK
I'm pleased to say they will be looked after.
LINK
In reply to Post #100
Done.
And chipped in too
Done.
And chipped in too
Rishi Sunak has launched his campaign to be Leader
A video.and his own new website .ReadyforRishi But when did he do.all this?
December
Domain Name: readyforrishi.com
Registry Domain ID: 2663481587_DOMAIN_COM-VRSN
Registrar WHOIS Server: https://t.co/p71dp5y2Et
Updated Date: 2021-12-23 T11:31:20Z
Creation Date: 2021-12-23 T11:31:19Z
They R all Snakz Bojo Hun. Call me xoxoxo
A video.and his own new website .ReadyforRishi But when did he do.all this?
December
Domain Name: readyforrishi.com
Registry Domain ID: 2663481587_DOMAIN_COM-VRSN
Registrar WHOIS Server: https://t.co/p71dp5y2Et
Updated Date: 2021-12-23 T11:31:20Z
Creation Date: 2021-12-23 T11:31:19Z
They R all Snakz Bojo Hun. Call me xoxoxo
In reply to Post #102
I see he is ready to fix the economy, broken by the previous Chancellor.
I see he is ready to fix the economy, broken by the previous Chancellor.
In reply to Post #103
The world economy is cyclical what politicians do is irrelevant .....
The world economy is cyclical what politicians do is irrelevant .....
In reply to Post #104
World economies may we'll be cyclical. How you do within those cycles as a country is very much influenced by politicians Interesting you think politicians make zero difference to the world economic cycle. Mr Putin, Bush/Blair etc ??
World economies may we'll be cyclical. How you do within those cycles as a country is very much influenced by politicians Interesting you think politicians make zero difference to the world economic cycle. Mr Putin, Bush/Blair etc ??
In reply to Post #105
Let's not forget that it was Gordon Brown that crashed the economy in 2008 (apparently)
When you're a Tory, it's Labour that did it, when it's a Tory that did it, it's "cyclical economies."
Let's not forget that it was Gordon Brown that crashed the economy in 2008 (apparently)
When you're a Tory, it's Labour that did it, when it's a Tory that did it, it's "cyclical economies."
In reply to Post #105
I missed out the ‘our' how are they going to fix inflation or provide a safe passage out of it?
I missed out the ‘our' how are they going to fix inflation or provide a safe passage out of it?
In reply to Post #106
Lol https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Financial_crisis_of_2007–2008
I'm neither btw
Lol https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Financial_crisis_of_2007–2008
I'm neither btw
In reply to Post #105
Their Puppets being told what to do by higher corporate powers holding them at ransom.....
Their Puppets being told what to do by higher corporate powers holding them at ransom.....
In reply to Post #102
Its called vote for me while I cook the books and get what I want even more
# bent as ****
I'm sorry. It I'm still looking for that leader, radical change ffs, out with all the con men and in with the commoners who want it for a passion!
What a shower of *****
Its called vote for me while I cook the books and get what I want even more
# bent as ****
I'm sorry. It I'm still looking for that leader, radical change ffs, out with all the con men and in with the commoners who want it for a passion!
What a shower of *****
In reply to Post #109
Their Puppets being told what to do by higher corporate powers holding them at random
Now you're just typing ransom words Nadine! Try downstreaming a dictionary.
Their Puppets being told what to do by higher corporate powers holding them at random
Now you're just typing ransom words Nadine! Try downstreaming a dictionary.
In reply to Post #111
I feel I may have been a little bit harsh on the government. This week alone I've been thoroughly spoiled as a teacher with 3 education ministers! And even the one who lasted a day was better than gavin feckin Williamson...
I feel I may have been a little bit harsh on the government. This week alone I've been thoroughly spoiled as a teacher with 3 education ministers! And even the one who lasted a day was better than gavin feckin Williamson...
Daily Mail spent 2 weeks. 2 weeks on Starmer calling it beergate. 2 weeks everyday it was on their front.page.
All to make us believe that 'they are all the same '
Tories forced a 2nd investigation by Durham Police and still.no case to answer.
Oh and they just lost a few million to Prince Harry for making stuff up.
Not a good week.for those hateful ****s
All to make us believe that 'they are all the same '
Tories forced a 2nd investigation by Durham Police and still.no case to answer.
Oh and they just lost a few million to Prince Harry for making stuff up.
Not a good week.for those hateful ****s
In reply to Post #113
I'm not convinced about Beergate.
I wonder what the outcome would've been if the same people who investigated Partygate, investigated Beergate?
For instance Sunak who doesn't drink got done for walking into what he thought was a meeting, I think that's plausible.
If that had happened to Starmer I don't think he would've just taken on the chin after saying he would resign.
I'm not defending Sunak, just trying to make the point that I don't think it was a level playing field.
Even though it's 3am I'm not going to lose sleep about it though, just thought I'd mention it, what's done is done, they'll be something else to talk about tomorrow.
Going to bed now as I've just been driving around for 5.5 hours and finding it difficult to unwind
I'm not convinced about Beergate.
I wonder what the outcome would've been if the same people who investigated Partygate, investigated Beergate?
For instance Sunak who doesn't drink got done for walking into what he thought was a meeting, I think that's plausible.
If that had happened to Starmer I don't think he would've just taken on the chin after saying he would resign.
I'm not defending Sunak, just trying to make the point that I don't think it was a level playing field.
Even though it's 3am I'm not going to lose sleep about it though, just thought I'd mention it, what's done is done, they'll be something else to talk about tomorrow.
Going to bed now as I've just been driving around for 5.5 hours and finding it difficult to unwind
In reply to Post #114
We should remember that despite numerous witnesses,
Reports, photos and videos. The Metropolitan Police point blank refused to investigate Number 10s parties. Stating at the time
that they had a policy not to investigate retrospectively.
They only agreed to investigate when issued with a law suit by a team of independent lawyers.
If you read Sue Grays report Johnson and other senior politicians got off very very lightly. Junior staff got.multiple fines for attending parties that seniors also attended.
Durham Police maybe aren't quite as cosy with Westminster. But under such public scrutiny I'm sure they were thorough.
We should remember that despite numerous witnesses,
Reports, photos and videos. The Metropolitan Police point blank refused to investigate Number 10s parties. Stating at the time
that they had a policy not to investigate retrospectively.
They only agreed to investigate when issued with a law suit by a team of independent lawyers.
If you read Sue Grays report Johnson and other senior politicians got off very very lightly. Junior staff got.multiple fines for attending parties that seniors also attended.
Durham Police maybe aren't quite as cosy with Westminster. But under such public scrutiny I'm sure they were thorough.
In reply to Post #107
You could also ask if this government has the ability or talent or will to navigate a successful way out of the issues you raise.
My view is we've had a totally wasted decade and the Tory's have blown the Brexit dividend if there even was one. I can never reward failure in positions of power and influence so a GE should be called. Rather than 180k wealthy retirees in this country deciding who the next PM is for us all.
One thing is unarguable though, they'll be doing so from a position they've created for us over the last 12 years, no one else.
You could also ask if this government has the ability or talent or will to navigate a successful way out of the issues you raise.
My view is we've had a totally wasted decade and the Tory's have blown the Brexit dividend if there even was one. I can never reward failure in positions of power and influence so a GE should be called. Rather than 180k wealthy retirees in this country deciding who the next PM is for us all.
One thing is unarguable though, they'll be doing so from a position they've created for us over the last 12 years, no one else.
In reply to Post #116
Indeed, we need a GE, and a new Government that ditches FPTP and embraces Proportional Representation.
Indeed, we need a GE, and a new Government that ditches FPTP and embraces Proportional Representation.
In reply to Post #118
All the problems you list are born from political decisions Noj. They're all public services owned by us, but overseen by politicians we elected You probably voted for what we have, fair enough, your right to. But it's extremely rich to vote for something and when it's shyte say it doesn't matter who you vote for.
All the problems you list are born from political decisions Noj. They're all public services owned by us, but overseen by politicians we elected You probably voted for what we have, fair enough, your right to. But it's extremely rich to vote for something and when it's shyte say it doesn't matter who you vote for.
In reply to Post #118
All of these things you mentioned have been eroded over the last decade as a result of austerity and Brexit.
We need to build Police levels up to where they were before being savagely cut by 14% since 2010. With that increase we need proper recruitment and vetting programs that ensure that the quality of Policing starts to improve - given the current state, that wouldn't be hard! It just needs proper investment and management.
The NHS is on it's knees because of Covid (and still is) but we've lost vast numbers of staff (Doctors, Nurses, Radiotherapists, X-Ray, Porters etc etc) that were from the EU and have left. We need to have a very honest discussion about where our Brexit / Borders policies have led us and start to undo those issues. It requires skilled Politicians who are capable of solving difficult problems and, not just dog-whistlers with no redeeming features like Priti Patel.
Schools suffer because of lack of consistency (continuous meddling in the curriculum) and lack of funding. With the proper resources, better staffing levels etc then a real difference can be made.
I don't know why you think the damage is done by "us"? I work 60+ hour weeks, can't do anymore for myself or my family; pay huge amounts of tax, be it income tax, or stealth taxes like VAT and fuel duty. I am putting in my fair share (and don't mind doing so.) Millions of others do the same, up and down the country; we provide the funding and that funding needs to be properly managed and deployed by the Govt. of the day. That simply isn't happening now and hasn't been for several years - which is why we need a change. They're ultimately responsible for the management of a successful society, yet at present, all they do is serve themselves.
All of these things you mentioned have been eroded over the last decade as a result of austerity and Brexit.
We need to build Police levels up to where they were before being savagely cut by 14% since 2010. With that increase we need proper recruitment and vetting programs that ensure that the quality of Policing starts to improve - given the current state, that wouldn't be hard! It just needs proper investment and management.
The NHS is on it's knees because of Covid (and still is) but we've lost vast numbers of staff (Doctors, Nurses, Radiotherapists, X-Ray, Porters etc etc) that were from the EU and have left. We need to have a very honest discussion about where our Brexit / Borders policies have led us and start to undo those issues. It requires skilled Politicians who are capable of solving difficult problems and, not just dog-whistlers with no redeeming features like Priti Patel.
Schools suffer because of lack of consistency (continuous meddling in the curriculum) and lack of funding. With the proper resources, better staffing levels etc then a real difference can be made.
I don't know why you think the damage is done by "us"? I work 60+ hour weeks, can't do anymore for myself or my family; pay huge amounts of tax, be it income tax, or stealth taxes like VAT and fuel duty. I am putting in my fair share (and don't mind doing so.) Millions of others do the same, up and down the country; we provide the funding and that funding needs to be properly managed and deployed by the Govt. of the day. That simply isn't happening now and hasn't been for several years - which is why we need a change. They're ultimately responsible for the management of a successful society, yet at present, all they do is serve themselves.
I don't know what the opposition parties are waiting for. Dint they have the means to trigger an election with a no confidence vote in the current government?
Are they just holding off so they can have their summer holidays?
Are they just holding off so they can have their summer holidays?
In reply to Post #121
They can call one Mal but what's the point when you'll lose. The Tory's have no problem with regicide but no stomach for a GE.
They can call one Mal but what's the point when you'll lose. The Tory's have no problem with regicide but no stomach for a GE.
Things can get better again. They did before.
After the 2nd World War we had huge societal changes.
Unions got us safer health conditions. Weekends, holidays sick pay. We had the brand new NHS from cradle to grave. Council housing for the poor.
Sadly here and USA there has been a slow eroding of these advances. Generally orchestrated by people that already have Billions.
But I believe we can change for the better.
After the 2nd World War we had huge societal changes.
Unions got us safer health conditions. Weekends, holidays sick pay. We had the brand new NHS from cradle to grave. Council housing for the poor.
Sadly here and USA there has been a slow eroding of these advances. Generally orchestrated by people that already have Billions.
But I believe we can change for the better.
In reply to Post #120
I wasn't going to get involved but have to ask this.
Do you not think there was no need for some sort of austerity after the 2008 crash, we should've carried on spending, accelerating the debt and when covid came just carry on spending?
Not going to get in an argument, just would like you views please.
I wasn't going to get involved but have to ask this.
Do you not think there was no need for some sort of austerity after the 2008 crash, we should've carried on spending, accelerating the debt and when covid came just carry on spending?
Not going to get in an argument, just would like you views please.
In reply to Post #119
In reply to Post #124
Your post would have more credence if you substitute investment for spending Sir Blankalot
Your post would have more credence if you substitute investment for spending Sir Blankalot
In reply to Post #125
Those individuals within the NHS you have a continual problem with should be judged as individuals. The way and principle a public service , from Aberdeen to Wrexham, York to Yarmouth is run is a political decision. You choose that outcome.
Those individuals within the NHS you have a continual problem with should be judged as individuals. The way and principle a public service , from Aberdeen to Wrexham, York to Yarmouth is run is a political decision. You choose that outcome.
In reply to Post #124
Perhaps we should have, but one thing that is worth thinking about is which countries weathered the 2008 collapse the best and to look at how their economic models differed from the UK and the US - who basically created the problem.
For instance, we had some fairly significant quantitive easing here - basically printing vast amounts of money which was simply pumped back into the system (bailouts) whereas countries that fared better had much smarter fiscal policies, and in the years that followed, this included huge investment - often funded by borrowing at rock bottom interest rates - which has since paid off the original debts and been hugely profitable both financially and Geopolitically.
Instead, we cut, cut cut, made life even more difficult for the less well off, did not invest in our industries (even sold off many of the better ones to overseas investors) nor did we invest in our public services properly.
Unfortunately - and I am trying to keep politics out of this, because I don't want to argue either - Tory economic policy, traditionally, follows all of the known capitalist trends which simply does not benefit most normal people, those who are doing the work (e.g. me and you); it just makes the rich people richer, and the poor people unhappier, unhealthier and angrier.
The way the UK reacted to the 2008 crash probably sowed the seeds for Brexit; as so many people had suffered financially and emotionally (see above) for so long, and with papers like The Mail demonising foreign people relentlessly - often blaming them for our domestic issues (that largely stemmed from political decisions), then in hindsight it's no surprise we voted to leave, although in my opinion the whole process was flawed and could have been carried out in a way that was vastly less damaging than it has been, though that's another discussion, and probably one that nobody wants to have (including me).
Short version - Austerity didn't achieve a thing.
In 2010, our national debt was 63% of GDP, it has climbed ever since (despite austerity) and is now running at about 99% of GDP.
We should have invested massively when borrowing was cheap.
Just my view.
Perhaps we should have, but one thing that is worth thinking about is which countries weathered the 2008 collapse the best and to look at how their economic models differed from the UK and the US - who basically created the problem.
For instance, we had some fairly significant quantitive easing here - basically printing vast amounts of money which was simply pumped back into the system (bailouts) whereas countries that fared better had much smarter fiscal policies, and in the years that followed, this included huge investment - often funded by borrowing at rock bottom interest rates - which has since paid off the original debts and been hugely profitable both financially and Geopolitically.
Instead, we cut, cut cut, made life even more difficult for the less well off, did not invest in our industries (even sold off many of the better ones to overseas investors) nor did we invest in our public services properly.
Unfortunately - and I am trying to keep politics out of this, because I don't want to argue either - Tory economic policy, traditionally, follows all of the known capitalist trends which simply does not benefit most normal people, those who are doing the work (e.g. me and you); it just makes the rich people richer, and the poor people unhappier, unhealthier and angrier.
The way the UK reacted to the 2008 crash probably sowed the seeds for Brexit; as so many people had suffered financially and emotionally (see above) for so long, and with papers like The Mail demonising foreign people relentlessly - often blaming them for our domestic issues (that largely stemmed from political decisions), then in hindsight it's no surprise we voted to leave, although in my opinion the whole process was flawed and could have been carried out in a way that was vastly less damaging than it has been, though that's another discussion, and probably one that nobody wants to have (including me).
Short version - Austerity didn't achieve a thing.
In 2010, our national debt was 63% of GDP, it has climbed ever since (despite austerity) and is now running at about 99% of GDP.
We should have invested massively when borrowing was cheap.
Just my view.
In reply to Post #127
70% of the last 43 years: tory
100% of the last 12 years: tory
If that works for you and your loved ones
That's great
100% of the last 12 years: tory
If that works for you and your loved ones
That's great
In reply to Post #130
You can twists stats to suit your narrative, we do it on here, Westminster does it, everybody does it.
I'm sure the Tories could pull a stat out of the bag to say they have been investing in the last 12years.
Labour left office with a £811 billion deficit. I got that figure from the internet, so that could have been manipulated.
Whatever the figure it was a lot. Let's say Labour had got back in would they have continued spending and increasing the debt. If so I wonder what sort of investing would they have done and would it have been successful.
I don't blame the 2008 recession wholly on the government of the time, I thought Gordon Brown was doing ok for a while. Then again I don't blame the current government wholly for the current crisis.
If we have a GE and Labour get in I hope they do well but I'm not confident in that, but I'd still want them to do well, why wouldn't I?
Extracting money from the rich has always been a difficult task. Maybe the easy option for them would be to hit the easier to target, those PAYE people who earn just above the higher tax threshold who can't hide their money.
Just my ramblings, people can tell me that I'm wrong but I will refer them to my first sentence.
I'm sure the Tories could pull a stat out of the bag to say they have been investing in the last 12years.
Labour left office with a £811 billion deficit. I got that figure from the internet, so that could have been manipulated.
Whatever the figure it was a lot. Let's say Labour had got back in would they have continued spending and increasing the debt. If so I wonder what sort of investing would they have done and would it have been successful.
I don't blame the 2008 recession wholly on the government of the time, I thought Gordon Brown was doing ok for a while. Then again I don't blame the current government wholly for the current crisis.
If we have a GE and Labour get in I hope they do well but I'm not confident in that, but I'd still want them to do well, why wouldn't I?
Extracting money from the rich has always been a difficult task. Maybe the easy option for them would be to hit the easier to target, those PAYE people who earn just above the higher tax threshold who can't hide their money.
Just my ramblings, people can tell me that I'm wrong but I will refer them to my first sentence.
In reply to Post #129
Obviously
Obviously
In reply to Post #132
As you well know, the prospects for a country are heavily weighted by education.
Spending per pupil in England is still lower than it was in 2009, roughly about 7k per pupil in state schools. That's been a political decision by the Tory party. Meanwhile private education per pupil has risen over that period to roughly 15k, double the states evaluation of what spending is necessary for a good education.
Twist that investment/spending in our future with that damning stat in a positive way mate
As you well know, the prospects for a country are heavily weighted by education.
Spending per pupil in England is still lower than it was in 2009, roughly about 7k per pupil in state schools. That's been a political decision by the Tory party. Meanwhile private education per pupil has risen over that period to roughly 15k, double the states evaluation of what spending is necessary for a good education.
Twist that investment/spending in our future with that damning stat in a positive way mate
In reply to Post #134
In reply to Post #134
Twist that investment/spending in our future with that damning stat in a positive way mate
I'm not here to twist stats.
Having worked for a company that relied on stats to boast great customer but in reality it was poor.
Having a local council that blatantly uses made up stats so they can ignore their residents means I take all stats with a pinch of salt.
I could go on.
All I believe is we as a country spent billions on covid measures so we shouldn't be surprised we now have money problems.
How many billions? I don't know but if someone from either side of the political divide in politics claims to know I won't be taking it as gospel.
Twist that investment/spending in our future with that damning stat in a positive way mate
I'm not here to twist stats.
Having worked for a company that relied on stats to boast great customer but in reality it was poor.
Having a local council that blatantly uses made up stats so they can ignore their residents means I take all stats with a pinch of salt.
I could go on.
All I believe is we as a country spent billions on covid measures so we shouldn't be surprised we now have money problems.
How many billions? I don't know but if someone from either side of the political divide in politics claims to know I won't be taking it as gospel.
In reply to Post #132
Starting to get some of this back "onshore" might help!
https://www.ft.com/content/a14162d0-0f65-4c63-842e-e0778516d03a
Starting to get some of this back "onshore" might help!
https://www.ft.com/content/a14162d0-0f65-4c63-842e-e0778516d03a
In reply to Post #137
UK admits it has no idea how much tax is being evaded through offshore assets
I'm not surprised, these people evading are not stupid. I hate to think how many decades it's been going on.
Chances are that although it's morally wrong it's not against the law, the question is can the laws be changed.
Not meaning to come across a defeatist but a simple yes from an expert on here won't do it for me.
UK admits it has no idea how much tax is being evaded through offshore assets
I'm not surprised, these people evading are not stupid. I hate to think how many decades it's been going on.
Chances are that although it's morally wrong it's not against the law, the question is can the laws be changed.
Not meaning to come across a defeatist but a simple yes from an expert on here won't do it for me.
In reply to Post #138
And the answer is highly unlikely, the next pm may well be a billionaire through marriage and if not him the likely successor will have close links to many billionaire's.
And the answer is highly unlikely, the next pm may well be a billionaire through marriage and if not him the likely successor will have close links to many billionaire's.
In reply to Post #139
money goes to money.
Look how all the parties are funded - from wealthy donors - those are the folk who really make the decisions we just deal with the puppets.
money goes to money.
Look how all the parties are funded - from wealthy donors - those are the folk who really make the decisions we just deal with the puppets.
In reply to Post #139
And anybody with that level of wealth is not in touch with the working man
They need to review the requirements to be a “commoner”
With so many gains to be had from offshore fiddles i am quite sure they could invest in a couple of hundred decent folk to start with to purse them, wonder why not
Pick the industry and up the import taxes, 25%, that should give us a boost and also give manufacturing in this country a good chance of survival
We need somebody with some bollox. Two divides now, conservatives as ever looking after the rich and the Labour Party, the one who looked out for the working man is now looking after the scroungers
Confidence 0%
And anybody with that level of wealth is not in touch with the working man
They need to review the requirements to be a “commoner”
With so many gains to be had from offshore fiddles i am quite sure they could invest in a couple of hundred decent folk to start with to purse them, wonder why not
Pick the industry and up the import taxes, 25%, that should give us a boost and also give manufacturing in this country a good chance of survival
We need somebody with some bollox. Two divides now, conservatives as ever looking after the rich and the Labour Party, the one who looked out for the working man is now looking after the scroungers
Confidence 0%
In reply to Post #141
In reply to Post #136
So you take statistics on our children's education, therefore our future prosperity with a pinch of salt comparing for justification your local council? No wonder we're in this endless mire.
#142
There'd be a bigger pool of millionaire types to choose from if every child was lined up on the same starting line mate.
So you take statistics on our children's education, therefore our future prosperity with a pinch of salt comparing for justification your local council? No wonder we're in this endless mire.
#142
There'd be a bigger pool of millionaire types to choose from if every child was lined up on the same starting line mate.
In reply to Post #143
Whoever comes in the other job that needs attention is the salaries in local councils it's all got out of hand.
Whoever comes in the other job that needs attention is the salaries in local councils it's all got out of hand.
In reply to Post #144
Has it??
Has it??
Patel is still too quiet for my liking....
Just waiting for the opening shots of her video, slow motion walking flanked by stormtroopers with the imperial death march as a soundtrack
Johnson remains utterly immune to the wants and needs of the people he's supposed to represent. Ultimate remoaner.
get Bexit done
Just waiting for the opening shots of her video, slow motion walking flanked by stormtroopers with the imperial death march as a soundtrack
Johnson remains utterly immune to the wants and needs of the people he's supposed to represent. Ultimate remoaner.
get Bexit done
In reply to Post #140
100% Jason.......them donors then have vested interests through their circle, their circles and on and on.....
100% Jason.......them donors then have vested interests through their circle, their circles and on and on.....
In reply to Post #143
I've tried and will continue to try to be neutral. But how do I know your children's education statistics are true?
I will continue to keep an open mind. Just because you think you are right doesn't mean you are.
Since I learnt about confirmation bias I've tried not to fall fail of it.
I've tried and will continue to try to be neutral. But how do I know your children's education statistics are true?
I will continue to keep an open mind. Just because you think you are right doesn't mean you are.
Since I learnt about confirmation bias I've tried not to fall fail of it.
In reply to Post #144
Don't start me on local councils!!! 
Don't start me on local councils!!!
In reply to Post #148
Here's a few more stats Sir Blankalot.
76% of pupils in a school in North Manchester are living in poverty, 900 kids. The principal says they are working with 15 other schools in a very similar position. The measure of child poverty is apparently a family income of £14k. Sounds a fair measure.
All the Tory pretender's lining up at the hustings, are any beating the drum to genuinely change this ?It'll and is bringing generations of issues if not tackled.
Only stats to be taken with a pinch of salt though....
Here's a few more stats Sir Blankalot.
76% of pupils in a school in North Manchester are living in poverty, 900 kids. The principal says they are working with 15 other schools in a very similar position. The measure of child poverty is apparently a family income of £14k. Sounds a fair measure.
All the Tory pretender's lining up at the hustings, are any beating the drum to genuinely change this ?It'll and is bringing generations of issues if not tackled.
Only stats to be taken with a pinch of salt though....
In reply to Post #150
In reply to Post #150
Maybe your local authority is trustworthy but The only experience I've got of local authorities is my own and they are bunch of corrupt self serving liars.
Maybe your local authority is trustworthy but The only experience I've got of local authorities is my own and they are bunch of corrupt self serving liars.
In reply to Post #151
What difference does that make in reality to the kids mate? Can I reiterate, 76% of the pupils, 900 kids in one school. Whilst spending on their education to help get them out of this poverty trap is now less than 2009. Whilst their peers in private education in welathy homes are getting double that. If you can't see the glaring problem fair enough.
What difference does that make in reality to the kids mate? Can I reiterate, 76% of the pupils, 900 kids in one school. Whilst spending on their education to help get them out of this poverty trap is now less than 2009. Whilst their peers in private education in welathy homes are getting double that. If you can't see the glaring problem fair enough.
In reply to Post #152
Yeah I know they've made your leafy suburban road in London take more traffic.....
Yeah I know they've made your leafy suburban road in London take more traffic.....
In reply to Post #154
And false stats to say it hasn't happened, it's a great success and is fighting climate change.
As I said earlier the company I worked for used false stats, Westminster use them, all walks of life use them.
As for schools my missus works in one and was telling me about pupil premium.
Anyway back to resignations. Who's going to win?
And false stats to say it hasn't happened, it's a great success and is fighting climate change.
As I said earlier the company I worked for used false stats, Westminster use them, all walks of life use them.
As for schools my missus works in one and was telling me about pupil premium.
Anyway back to resignations. Who's going to win?
In reply to Post #155
Who's going to win? .....
A rich tory?
Who's going to win? .....
A rich tory?
In reply to Post #156
Yes although some are considerably richer than others
Can't help myself. Boris is worth £2million and Keir is worth £7.7million. Can you believe that stat?
Yes although some are considerably richer than others
Can't help myself. Boris is worth £2million and Keir is worth £7.7million. Can you believe that stat?
In reply to Post #157
To be fair, I don't think personal wealth should come into it but when people have quite few million knocking about they know what they are on with, try and tell me that they are totally unbiased, and don't have an invested interest somewhere along the line, no ****ing way!
When leading this country they should be totally unbiased and filtered for financial gains or investments etc. If they want to sell their story afterwards then thats their choice
I am all for educating the youth and this country has got a pretty good track record compared to others. Ultimately there needs to be jobs at the end of it! now there's a story in itself
To be fair, I don't think personal wealth should come into it but when people have quite few million knocking about they know what they are on with, try and tell me that they are totally unbiased, and don't have an invested interest somewhere along the line, no ****ing way!
When leading this country they should be totally unbiased and filtered for financial gains or investments etc. If they want to sell their story afterwards then thats their choice
I am all for educating the youth and this country has got a pretty good track record compared to others. Ultimately there needs to be jobs at the end of it! now there's a story in itself
In reply to Post #157
Taking into account maintenance for the undisclosed (he pays a lawyer to stop is knowing) number of kids he's walked away from, sure.
Taking into account maintenance for the undisclosed (he pays a lawyer to stop is knowing) number of kids he's walked away from, sure.
In reply to Post #155
Are they false stats? or are they just manipulated?
Are they false stats? or are they just manipulated?
In reply to Post #158
When I went to school you had to be exceptionally bright to go to university. only a handful from each year made it, now it's the norm.
At school we were encouraged to take apprenticeship jobs, proper apprenticeships I'll add.
Nowadays it seems a way of companies being able to get cheap labour. Or companies naming jobs as apprenticeships to tick boxes (stats) when they are nothing of the sort.
We need a mindset change.
We need it in fishing as well, too many off the shelf instant anglers and not enough going through a fishing apprenticeship
Oops apologies I seem to have gone off topic again!
When I went to school you had to be exceptionally bright to go to university. only a handful from each year made it, now it's the norm.
At school we were encouraged to take apprenticeship jobs, proper apprenticeships I'll add.
Nowadays it seems a way of companies being able to get cheap labour. Or companies naming jobs as apprenticeships to tick boxes (stats) when they are nothing of the sort.
We need a mindset change.
We need it in fishing as well, too many off the shelf instant anglers and not enough going through a fishing apprenticeship
Oops apologies I seem to have gone off topic again!
In reply to Post #156
Rishi
Rishi
In reply to Post #161
Oh yeah, let's have some culture wars in fishing!
Can you explain exactly how the date on which the bloke in the swim next door took up fishing detracts or enhances your experience on the bank?
Elitist BS creating divides that serve no one decent.
Oh yeah, let's have some culture wars in fishing!
Can you explain exactly how the date on which the bloke in the swim next door took up fishing detracts or enhances your experience on the bank?
Elitist BS creating divides that serve no one decent.
In reply to Post #163
I can explain but I'm not going to other than to say apprenticeships (proper apprenticeships) are a good thing in my opinion, that's assuming I'm allowed to have an opinion on here
I can explain but I'm not going to other than to say apprenticeships (proper apprenticeships) are a good thing in my opinion, that's assuming I'm allowed to have an opinion on here
In reply to Post #164
Is anyone saying they arent a good thing then??
Is anyone saying they arent a good thing then??
In reply to Post #165
When it comes to fishing there seems to be.
When it comes to fishing there seems to be.
In reply to Post #166
Well Rishi tops the first ballot.
Starmer continues to waffle on.......he's just like corbyn...pointless
Well Rishi tops the first ballot.
Starmer continues to waffle on.......he's just like corbyn...pointless
In reply to Post #163
In reply to Post #161
I've had several graduates working for me over the years and I'm sad to say that without exception, they all needed very close supervision, some for a considerable amount of time.
The ones that had an over inflated opinion of themselves so had a reluctance to heed advice/ guidance were the hardest work. Most were just lacking common sense and didn't have any concept of logical thinking. Almost all couldn't even begin to fault find a relatively simple problem, and surprisingly some needed a calculator to perform even a simple calculation.
Seeing them doing anything practical was very entertaining though so not all bad.
Not really what industry needs so yes I agree a mind set change is needed but highly unlikely it will happen as things are at present.
I've had several graduates working for me over the years and I'm sad to say that without exception, they all needed very close supervision, some for a considerable amount of time.
The ones that had an over inflated opinion of themselves so had a reluctance to heed advice/ guidance were the hardest work. Most were just lacking common sense and didn't have any concept of logical thinking. Almost all couldn't even begin to fault find a relatively simple problem, and surprisingly some needed a calculator to perform even a simple calculation.
Seeing them doing anything practical was very entertaining though so not all bad.
Not really what industry needs so yes I agree a mind set change is needed but highly unlikely it will happen as things are at present.
In reply to Post #161
Apprenticeships are still there but not in the numbers they were sadly. We have always took apprentices on at the last few places I have worked
The sad thing, the kids need to be training up in different skills moving forward, manufacturing is becoming a thing of the past in this country, and while we are talking fishing, just like all these rip off merchants pedalling Chinese junk, that's why the jobs are going, can't compete when they can employ 8 Chinese to one Brit
And also consider the mongs in this country who have desire to work, we are ****ed
Apprenticeships are still there but not in the numbers they were sadly. We have always took apprentices on at the last few places I have worked
The sad thing, the kids need to be training up in different skills moving forward, manufacturing is becoming a thing of the past in this country, and while we are talking fishing, just like all these rip off merchants pedalling Chinese junk, that's why the jobs are going, can't compete when they can employ 8 Chinese to one Brit
And also consider the mongs in this country who have desire to work, we are ****ed
In reply to Post #164
No you're not 😂
No you're not 😂
In reply to Post #167
Sunak is a staunch Brexiteer, not supported and viewed as a rat and having questionable Tory values (whatever they are in 2022)by ultra Brexiteers, Mogg, Dories, etc.
Maudant is a remainer but supported by the above minister for Brexit opportunities and other Brexiteers
It's consuming itself the Tory party.
150k wealthy retirees will choose who we get out of those 2. Not very inspiring or democratic I'm afraid.
#164
As a heavy poster on this thread, you've answered your own daft question
Sunak is a staunch Brexiteer, not supported and viewed as a rat and having questionable Tory values (whatever they are in 2022)by ultra Brexiteers, Mogg, Dories, etc.
Maudant is a remainer but supported by the above minister for Brexit opportunities and other Brexiteers
It's consuming itself the Tory party.
150k wealthy retirees will choose who we get out of those 2. Not very inspiring or democratic I'm afraid.
#164
As a heavy poster on this thread, you've answered your own daft question
In reply to Post #172
Whatever I'm happy with a conservative government.
Whatever I'm happy with a conservative government.
In reply to Post #173
In reply to Post #174
Yep never vote for labour. I was watching the report on the abuse that went on in Telford over a 1000 children groomed the labour council turned a blind eye.
Same as Rotherham & Oldham.
Lefty labour no thanks
Yep never vote for labour. I was watching the report on the abuse that went on in Telford over a 1000 children groomed the labour council turned a blind eye.
Same as Rotherham & Oldham.
Lefty labour no thanks
In reply to Post #175
Whilst the cross party council did indeed fail, so did the Police, but you didn't bother mentioning that.
Oh, and: Tory Councillor Nonce
or
Tory MP Nonce
Whilst the cross party council did indeed fail, so did the Police, but you didn't bother mentioning that.
Oh, and: Tory Councillor Nonce
or
Tory MP Nonce
In reply to Post #173
#108
#108
For every Tory nonce you'll find Lefty nonce.
In reply to Post #175
Yep never vote for labour. I was watching the report on the abuse that went on in Telford over a 1000 children groomed the labour council turned a blind eye.
It's absolutely sick they think because they've appologised to the abused the abused can just put it all behind them "wipe your mouth and move on attitude".
The insult reasoning from West Mercia constabulary was they were advised not to pursue it as it may of caused racial tensions, WTF race aside it's the sickest act there is then they get paltry sentencing and out in half the time anyway, whatever race, colour, creed, religion the abuser is they should never see the light of day again, of what use in this world is a person like this that they absolutely destroy a child's hopes dreams and aspirations for their own sexual gratification and those who let this happen are as bad in my book, heads should roll literally.
Yep never vote for labour. I was watching the report on the abuse that went on in Telford over a 1000 children groomed the labour council turned a blind eye.
It's absolutely sick they think because they've appologised to the abused the abused can just put it all behind them "wipe your mouth and move on attitude".
The insult reasoning from West Mercia constabulary was they were advised not to pursue it as it may of caused racial tensions, WTF race aside it's the sickest act there is then they get paltry sentencing and out in half the time anyway, whatever race, colour, creed, religion the abuser is they should never see the light of day again, of what use in this world is a person like this that they absolutely destroy a child's hopes dreams and aspirations for their own sexual gratification and those who let this happen are as bad in my book, heads should roll literally.
In reply to Post #178
OK, so presumably you'll vote for neither Tory nor Labour?
Who are the Labour ones anyway? I can't find anything other than Lord Jannick, and accusations against him appears to have been unfounded.
OK, so presumably you'll vote for neither Tory nor Labour?
Who are the Labour ones anyway? I can't find anything other than Lord Jannick, and accusations against him appears to have been unfounded.
In reply to Post #176
I don't need to you went went on about conservatives spending to educate children etc etc whilst labour couldn't even protect them....from the most disgusting crimes imaginable - life's ruined .
I'm hoping all those in power council police go to prison when this is all over but no we get the same “lessons have been learnt” rhetoric
So that's why I'll never vote for them..
And I'm sure their is much much more to come out.
I don't need to you went went on about conservatives spending to educate children etc etc whilst labour couldn't even protect them....from the most disgusting crimes imaginable - life's ruined .
I'm hoping all those in power council police go to prison when this is all over but no we get the same “lessons have been learnt” rhetoric
So that's why I'll never vote for them..
And I'm sure their is much much more to come out.
In reply to Post #181
I agree with that 100% - anyone who was culpable should face the music.
However, I think it's a stretch to say that "labour couldn't even protect them" when it was cross party council (Labour, Tories, LD's and an Independent) and more significantly the Police that failed those kids. It wasn't "Labour" as you're trying to frame it.
Seems to me to be even more of a stretch to try to link such an argument to my comments about how Education / Schools have been badly hampered due to a result of bad policies and continued underfunding by a majority Tory Government over the course of the last decade - the two discussions just aren't linked in any meaningful way.
Anyway, you'll be happy with your conservative government after this conservative leadership contest has played out, where the only possible outcome is a conservative MP winning it.
Then hopefully, when there is a GE, the conservatives will be annihilated.
I agree with that 100% - anyone who was culpable should face the music.
However, I think it's a stretch to say that "labour couldn't even protect them" when it was cross party council (Labour, Tories, LD's and an Independent) and more significantly the Police that failed those kids. It wasn't "Labour" as you're trying to frame it.
Seems to me to be even more of a stretch to try to link such an argument to my comments about how Education / Schools have been badly hampered due to a result of bad policies and continued underfunding by a majority Tory Government over the course of the last decade - the two discussions just aren't linked in any meaningful way.
Anyway, you'll be happy with your conservative government after this conservative leadership contest has played out, where the only possible outcome is a conservative MP winning it.
Then hopefully, when there is a GE, the conservatives will be annihilated.
In reply to Post #182
I note the council have apologised and accepted 47 recommendations for improvement and there are some interesting comments - just found this link
https://www.localgov.co.uk/Council-apologises-for-child-sexual-exploitation/54522
I note the council have apologised and accepted 47 recommendations for improvement and there are some interesting comments - just found this link
https://www.localgov.co.uk/Council-apologises-for-child-sexual-exploitation/54522
In reply to Post #175
Apparently over a 40 year period, which would suggest not only labour let them down, but so did the tories......
Apparently over a 40 year period, which would suggest not only labour let them down, but so did the tories......
In reply to Post #182
Starmer CPS never prosecuted grooming gangs and should be accountable for what he did. Ken Livingstone and other Labour scum tried to shut down Ann Cryer for calling out those very gangs.
Starmer appointed Naz Shah to the shadow cabinet for Community Cohesion, she said in a tweet, "Victims of child sexual exploitation should remain quiet for the sake of diversity."
It seems the lefts obsession with diversity is more important than a child's life and innocence.
Like I said left and right.
https://labour25.com/
Starmer CPS never prosecuted grooming gangs and should be accountable for what he did. Ken Livingstone and other Labour scum tried to shut down Ann Cryer for calling out those very gangs.
Starmer appointed Naz Shah to the shadow cabinet for Community Cohesion, she said in a tweet, "Victims of child sexual exploitation should remain quiet for the sake of diversity."
It seems the lefts obsession with diversity is more important than a child's life and innocence.
Like I said left and right.
https://labour25.com/
In reply to Post #185
So no examples of Labour MP's and Councillors abusing children? Didn't think so.
If not, your post is a complete straw man argument which I suppose you have to make to try and justify your vote for a party that's destroyed the country, and our standing on the world stage.
So no examples of Labour MP's and Councillors abusing children? Didn't think so.
If not, your post is a complete straw man argument which I suppose you have to make to try and justify your vote for a party that's destroyed the country, and our standing on the world stage.
In reply to Post #186
Lol you've changed your post about Thatcher with jimmy Saville, is that because you forgot about Gordon Brown....🤣
Well here's a reminder
https://www.flickr.com/photos/downingstreet/2625100712
Lol you've changed your post about Thatcher with jimmy Saville, is that because you forgot about Gordon Brown....🤣
Well here's a reminder
https://www.flickr.com/photos/downingstreet/2625100712
In reply to Post #187
Well, the Bevin Boys selected Saville for the medal, not Brown.
Whereas Thatcher was very friendly with Saville, most likely due to his links with all the other Tory nonces, especially those frequenting Dolphin Square.
https://www.vanityfair.com/style/scandal/2014/12/scandal-dolphin-square-london
However, I am sure that you knew all this but will do anything and say anything to try and defend your reprehensible position and support of the Tories.
Crack on - hopefully next time the Tories are voted out, voting rules are changed and we'll never have to endure a lost decade as a result of appalling Government ever again.
Well, the Bevin Boys selected Saville for the medal, not Brown.
Whereas Thatcher was very friendly with Saville, most likely due to his links with all the other Tory nonces, especially those frequenting Dolphin Square.
https://www.vanityfair.com/style/scandal/2014/12/scandal-dolphin-square-london
However, I am sure that you knew all this but will do anything and say anything to try and defend your reprehensible position and support of the Tories.
Crack on - hopefully next time the Tories are voted out, voting rules are changed and we'll never have to endure a lost decade as a result of appalling Government ever again.
In reply to Post #186
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10874571/Ex-Labour-councillor-jailed-3-years-sharing-child-sex-abuse-videos.html
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10874571/Ex-Labour-councillor-jailed-3-years-sharing-child-sex-abuse-videos.html
Interesting seeing all of the nasty little skeletons falling out of the closets of the 'contenders'
Safe to say that whichever one wins we've simply got another **** on our hands...
Safe to say that whichever one wins we've simply got another **** on our hands...
In reply to Post #190
Truss or Sunak - doesn't matter, both are hopelessly tainted and come GE time the Tories will be toast, and bloody good riddance.
Truss or Sunak - doesn't matter, both are hopelessly tainted and come GE time the Tories will be toast, and bloody good riddance.
In reply to Post #191
And following a GE labour win and the UK saved everyone lived happily ever after....dream dream dream
And following a GE labour win and the UK saved everyone lived happily ever after....dream dream dream
In reply to Post #192
Of course not - but at least we might be able to start repairing the damage, getting rid of corruption and making the UK a better place, which everyone one of us deserves. The current trajectory is unsustainable.
Of course not - but at least we might be able to start repairing the damage, getting rid of corruption and making the UK a better place, which everyone one of us deserves. The current trajectory is unsustainable.
In reply to Post #194
Blofeld would be a step up from the current choices...
Blofeld would be a step up from the current choices...
In reply to Post #193
You know this is all tongue in cheek
I don't believe be it conservative, labour, lib dem, Green Party etc etc they are all greedy selfish people just in it for personal gain..promising the undeliverable to get our votes.
You know this is all tongue in cheek
I don't believe be it conservative, labour, lib dem, Green Party etc etc they are all greedy selfish people just in it for personal gain..promising the undeliverable to get our votes.
In reply to Post #196
I genuinely believe there are some good eggs among the bad. Theresa May for example, I believe she wasnt in it for greed, Corbyn the same.
I genuinely believe there are some good eggs among the bad. Theresa May for example, I believe she wasnt in it for greed, Corbyn the same.
In reply to Post #186
There is a link to 25 of them in post 185.
There is a link to 25 of them in post 185.
In reply to Post #196
You do come across as a joker,so fair enough
#194
TC's internet is likely to be off grid and he's probably a bit skint after obliterating all those spombs and paying for fast taper poker stiff custom rods he bought.For the moody, windswept low stock big pit that the fish never showed in but you had to put baits out at 40 wraps.
You do come across as a joker,so fair enough
#194
TC's internet is likely to be off grid and he's probably a bit skint after obliterating all those spombs and paying for fast taper poker stiff custom rods he bought.For the moody, windswept low stock big pit that the fish never showed in but you had to put baits out at 40 wraps.
In reply to Post #199
When it comes to politics as they are all laughing at us
When it comes to politics as they are all laughing at us
In reply to Post #199
In reply to Post #201
I'm not sure anyone does......
I'm not sure anyone does......
In reply to Post #202
In reply to Post #203
Imagine that... even amongst that awful lot, you can't find a tory who's prejudiced enough...
I'm sure if you told them it was a vote winner for you they'd tell you whatever lie you needed to hear noj.
I didn't watch the debate. If I want to watch a bunch of selfish, vain, dishonest, manipulative wastes of skin using the telly to try and push themselves i'll do Love Island - at least the view is better on that one.
It's looking like it'll come down to rishi vs mordaunt in the final.
Saw a great new name for the tories yesterday. Tha 'selfservatives' - made me chuckle that one.
Imagine that... even amongst that awful lot, you can't find a tory who's prejudiced enough...
I'm sure if you told them it was a vote winner for you they'd tell you whatever lie you needed to hear noj.
I didn't watch the debate. If I want to watch a bunch of selfish, vain, dishonest, manipulative wastes of skin using the telly to try and push themselves i'll do Love Island - at least the view is better on that one.
It's looking like it'll come down to rishi vs mordaunt in the final.
Saw a great new name for the tories yesterday. Tha 'selfservatives' - made me chuckle that one.
Britain would still be Great if Wolfy Smiff had been pm all those years ago.
In reply to Post #206
Something to ease the mood and bring a smile on a Saturday...
https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMNm4xMVb/
Something to ease the mood and bring a smile on a Saturday...
https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMNm4xMVb/
In reply to Post #205
In reply to Post #206
Exactley, Power to the people
Exactley, Power to the people
In reply to Post #208
If you dont vote, you cant moan
If you dont vote, you cant moan
In reply to Post #210
In reply to Post #211
I'd like the option of a ''None of the above' on a voting paper.
Meanwhile why not spoil you paper in protest by writing 'they are all a bunch of ****s'.
Get a postal vote so you don't have to waste time visiting a polling station.
I'd like the option of a ''None of the above' on a voting paper.
Meanwhile why not spoil you paper in protest by writing 'they are all a bunch of ****s'.
Get a postal vote so you don't have to waste time visiting a polling station.
In reply to Post #211
There's roughly 7 million TU members in the UK, mostly working people.There is roughly 160k Tory party members, mostly retirees. The 160k will be dictating who takes us forward as a country Noj, they're the facts.
There's roughly 7 million TU members in the UK, mostly working people.There is roughly 160k Tory party members, mostly retirees. The 160k will be dictating who takes us forward as a country Noj, they're the facts.
In reply to Post #213
Mostly middle class, wealthy retirees...
No need for a change when everything is fine for them.
If starmer could step aside and let rayner- or better still hess Phillips - take over, then I'd lend labour my vote in a GE
Mostly middle class, wealthy retirees...
No need for a change when everything is fine for them.
If starmer could step aside and let rayner- or better still hess Phillips - take over, then I'd lend labour my vote in a GE
In reply to Post #213
In reply to Post #215
That's probably because they rarely strike in Health care
And when they do they organise rotas for care giving.
The fact that transport people that do strike do better than nurses that won't or can't shows unions do work.
The fact that Govts take the piss out of Nurses because they know that they are ethically opposed to striking is gutless and not be applauded.
That's probably because they rarely strike in Health care
And when they do they organise rotas for care giving.
The fact that transport people that do strike do better than nurses that won't or can't shows unions do work.
The fact that Govts take the piss out of Nurses because they know that they are ethically opposed to striking is gutless and not be applauded.
In reply to Post #216
In reply to Post #215
Who says that large swathes of those 7 million aren't successful?
Just have a different view on how society improves for the majority.
Collective bargaining doesn't mean you can't negotiate your own T&C's as you get a vote on accepting or rejecting the offer.
Surprised you take a knee too the 160k though mate
Who says that large swathes of those 7 million aren't successful?
Just have a different view on how society improves for the majority.
Collective bargaining doesn't mean you can't negotiate your own T&C's as you get a vote on accepting or rejecting the offer.
Surprised you take a knee too the 160k though mate
In reply to Post #217
Where would the average working person be
If we never had unions? And if they were successfully outlawed?
How.long before a brave entrepreneur 'success'
person drove our life and conditions back to pre ww2?
Nothing we have was ever given freely it all had to fought for. BuI guess that generation has died out and its not much in memory.
I find the strikes inconvenient. I also think a bloke with 4 GCSE
Getting 50k + a year to drive trains is a discrepancy when a degree educated Nurse has had to pay their own Bursary and is starting on 24k. However with no Unions history has shown us
The train driver would earn dick.all.and the Nurse even less.
Where would the average working person be
If we never had unions? And if they were successfully outlawed?
How.long before a brave entrepreneur 'success'
person drove our life and conditions back to pre ww2?
Nothing we have was ever given freely it all had to fought for. BuI guess that generation has died out and its not much in memory.
I find the strikes inconvenient. I also think a bloke with 4 GCSE
Getting 50k + a year to drive trains is a discrepancy when a degree educated Nurse has had to pay their own Bursary and is starting on 24k. However with no Unions history has shown us
The train driver would earn dick.all.and the Nurse even less.
In reply to Post #218
In reply to Post #220
Non Labour voters who are union members...
That's me.
I recognise the value of unions and also have questioned strikes when the effect might damage student progress at critical times
This thread is a bit of a microcosm of the way tory government operates - set the people against each other and let them argue while ministers and their cronies carry on screwing over the populous.
Non Labour voters who are union members...
That's me.
I recognise the value of unions and also have questioned strikes when the effect might damage student progress at critical times
This thread is a bit of a microcosm of the way tory government operates - set the people against each other and let them argue while ministers and their cronies carry on screwing over the populous.
In reply to Post #219
Train drivers don't start of 50k a year. Their is a decent amount of training before they qualify, in my my day it was CSEs and O levels. Half the degrees these days are not worth the paper they are written on.
Nurses can end up on a reasonable salary and lots of opportunity to specialize.
Got to remember nurses get a nice civil service pension at the end of it all - so you really need to look at the long game whatever you decide to do
Train drivers don't start of 50k a year. Their is a decent amount of training before they qualify, in my my day it was CSEs and O levels. Half the degrees these days are not worth the paper they are written on.
Nurses can end up on a reasonable salary and lots of opportunity to specialize.
Got to remember nurses get a nice civil service pension at the end of it all - so you really need to look at the long game whatever you decide to do
In reply to Post #222
Can't agree on the nurses pay regardless of the pension.
When they arrive at work and have to pay exorbitant rates to park so they can go and save lives for less than the shoddy mp's who voted against their pay rise then there's something very wrong.
The best paid people in the NHS are the ones making poor managerial decisions I'm afraid.
Can't agree on the nurses pay regardless of the pension.
When they arrive at work and have to pay exorbitant rates to park so they can go and save lives for less than the shoddy mp's who voted against their pay rise then there's something very wrong.
The best paid people in the NHS are the ones making poor managerial decisions I'm afraid.
In reply to Post #220
Mate these Tory MPs on TV that are still running the race are pitching to a profiled tiny group that will ultimately decide who gets the job. Not 65 million people,160k. That's not to be forgotten in the policies they're promising we will all have live under. You see the positive in it I think it's ridiculous 👍.
Sunak and the Lib Dem remainer Truss have had the latest TV debate cancelled. They don't want to look bad and there's no miles in a pitch to the nation, just the members
Mate these Tory MPs on TV that are still running the race are pitching to a profiled tiny group that will ultimately decide who gets the job. Not 65 million people,160k. That's not to be forgotten in the policies they're promising we will all have live under. You see the positive in it I think it's ridiculous 👍.
Sunak and the Lib Dem remainer Truss have had the latest TV debate cancelled. They don't want to look bad and there's no miles in a pitch to the nation, just the members
In reply to Post #223
Sorry I've a friend who works in the police force and has to pay the daily rate for public parking. It's the same for 100s who work there and I'm told it happens at many other stations
They are told if the don't like it use public transport which costs even more.
At some point we will all have a black box fitted in our cars and be paying per mile.
Sorry I've a friend who works in the police force and has to pay the daily rate for public parking. It's the same for 100s who work there and I'm told it happens at many other stations
They are told if the don't like it use public transport which costs even more.
At some point we will all have a black box fitted in our cars and be paying per mile.
In reply to Post #224
It's just a change of leader not a general election.
It's just a change of leader not a general election.
In reply to Post #226
Correct. From what I've seen the wannabes are pitching a full change of direction and not a Johnson continuity government. There's a difference.
Correct. From what I've seen the wannabes are pitching a full change of direction and not a Johnson continuity government. There's a difference.
In reply to Post #225
Thought coppers get free public transport,
Thought coppers get free public transport,
In reply to Post #228
She is not a copper
She is not a copper
In reply to Post #227
Makes no difference the economy will fall on its backside end of this year / 23 oh then you can blame the tories saying it would never have happened under a labour government
Makes no difference the economy will fall on its backside end of this year / 23 oh then you can blame the tories saying it would never have happened under a labour government
In reply to Post #230
After 13 years by that point it'd be a fair assessment wouldn't you say?
Before you pigeon hole people you don't know, I've voted Green, Independent, labour and Tory at GE's. Dependant on who I thought had a best vision for the country. Can you say the same?
After 13 years by that point it'd be a fair assessment wouldn't you say?
Before you pigeon hole people you don't know, I've voted Green, Independent, labour and Tory at GE's. Dependant on who I thought had a best vision for the country. Can you say the same?
Is this what this country deserves as PM
So... it now comes to light that Rishi Sunak's wife was part owner of Lava Mayfair Club Ltd (a private membership gym), which collapsed last year owing almost £44million to creditors, including £374,000 to HMRC!
Another of Mrs Sunak's ventures... Mrs Wordsmith (an education business) went into administration last year owing £16.3million – after receiving a £1.3million loan from the Government's "Future Fund"!
OH IT GETS WORSE... Digme Fitness (which she owns 100% of) received up to £635,000 of furlough money... before it then closed its eight studios in London and Oxford... still owing HMRC £415,000!
So .... Mr Sunak introduces the furlough scheme ... and the woman he's sleeping with benefits by up to £635,000!
Mr Sunak oversees the rules regarding Non-Dom status ... and the woman he's sleeping with benefits by over £20 million!
Mr Sunak is in charge of ensuring that the UK maximises its tax revenue... yet the woman he's sleeping with has been active in, or has owned, companies going bust owing a staggering £789,000 to HMRC!
Mr Sunak says his wife's tax affairs are none of OUR business... he can **** RIGHT off!!
Arrogance in almost immeasurable amounts!
So... it now comes to light that Rishi Sunak's wife was part owner of Lava Mayfair Club Ltd (a private membership gym), which collapsed last year owing almost £44million to creditors, including £374,000 to HMRC!
Another of Mrs Sunak's ventures... Mrs Wordsmith (an education business) went into administration last year owing £16.3million – after receiving a £1.3million loan from the Government's "Future Fund"!
OH IT GETS WORSE... Digme Fitness (which she owns 100% of) received up to £635,000 of furlough money... before it then closed its eight studios in London and Oxford... still owing HMRC £415,000!
So .... Mr Sunak introduces the furlough scheme ... and the woman he's sleeping with benefits by up to £635,000!
Mr Sunak oversees the rules regarding Non-Dom status ... and the woman he's sleeping with benefits by over £20 million!
Mr Sunak is in charge of ensuring that the UK maximises its tax revenue... yet the woman he's sleeping with has been active in, or has owned, companies going bust owing a staggering £789,000 to HMRC!
Mr Sunak says his wife's tax affairs are none of OUR business... he can **** RIGHT off!!
Arrogance in almost immeasurable amounts!
In reply to Post #232
People often innocent ask , bless em, why does a man with such wealth and that married into Billions do a 100k a year job for the Govt?
Because it puts him in a position to increase the family wealth
People often innocent ask , bless em, why does a man with such wealth and that married into Billions do a 100k a year job for the Govt?
Because it puts him in a position to increase the family wealth
In reply to Post #233
Proper tory eh?
And ocelot.... you voted Green...?
I always did like you
Proper tory eh?
And ocelot.... you voted Green...?
I always did like you
In reply to Post #231
I don't vote it's a waste of time. But you assume I'm Tory...,
So your really telling us you voted on who had the best vision and for some reason you once picked the Greens.....your a salesman's dream.
I don't vote it's a waste of time. But you assume I'm Tory...,
So your really telling us you voted on who had the best vision and for some reason you once picked the Greens.....your a salesman's dream.
In reply to Post #232
Not defending her just questioning the data you posted
Digme Fitness I checked on companies house less than 5%
Bambers owned most of it.
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/09631514/persons-with-significant-control
Lava Mayfair again small amount
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/10075472/persons-with-significant-control
Not defending her just questioning the data you posted
Digme Fitness I checked on companies house less than 5%
Bambers owned most of it.
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/09631514/persons-with-significant-control
Lava Mayfair again small amount
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/10075472/persons-with-significant-control
In reply to Post #236
My post says part owned.
My post says part owned.
Forget resignations......
Who is the lefty vegan eating GBVTKL++ **** setting fire to London fields so the media can blame it all on climate change bollox.......
Who is the lefty vegan eating GBVTKL++ **** setting fire to London fields so the media can blame it all on climate change bollox.......
In reply to Post #235
Cough #173
Cough #173
In reply to Post #238
Schengen trying to put the Albanian growers out of business.
Schengen trying to put the Albanian growers out of business.
In reply to Post #238
In reply to Post #238
These two have form.
https://rochdaleherald.co.uk/2017/06/24/corbyn-stuns-glastonbury-with-acapella-cover-of-prodigys-firestarter-on-pyramid-stage/
https://news.sky.com/video/video-piers-corbyn-fire-breathing-at-anti-government-protest-in-london-12461361
These two have form.
https://rochdaleherald.co.uk/2017/06/24/corbyn-stuns-glastonbury-with-acapella-cover-of-prodigys-firestarter-on-pyramid-stage/
https://news.sky.com/video/video-piers-corbyn-fire-breathing-at-anti-government-protest-in-london-12461361
In reply to Post #241
Genuinely heard someone say 'I feel sorry for the firemen having to work in this heat' .....
As for the fire, rumours that it was started by rishi sunak trying to dispose of his wife's tax returns are not confirmed. Yet
Genuinely heard someone say 'I feel sorry for the firemen having to work in this heat' .....
As for the fire, rumours that it was started by rishi sunak trying to dispose of his wife's tax returns are not confirmed. Yet
In reply to Post #243
In reply to Post #244
Probably some numb nuts with a barbecue from tesco...
Or nurses and police burning their below inflation pay 'rise' offers?
Probably some numb nuts with a barbecue from tesco...
Or nurses and police burning their below inflation pay 'rise' offers?
In reply to Post #245
https://youtu.be/wmin5WkOuPw
https://youtu.be/wmin5WkOuPw
In reply to Post #235
Yes the Greens. It was a choice between Johnson and Corbyn and I will always use my vote unlike some.
The Green candidate I've known on and off for 30 years. Ex Royal Green jacket, had been inside a few times etc. But he inherited a few bob years ago and bought a little copse off the arm of a canal from a farmer he knew. Built a tree house to live in with his collie and had a small barge moored up.
Reckoned he lived off bark ,moss and bream for years. Several times a year he visited a different galaxy , which was unreal so decided to stand as an MP to pass on the vision. Brilliant artist and fantastic wood worker building guitars for commercial sale also.
That was my Green candidate so voted for him
Yes the Greens. It was a choice between Johnson and Corbyn and I will always use my vote unlike some.
The Green candidate I've known on and off for 30 years. Ex Royal Green jacket, had been inside a few times etc. But he inherited a few bob years ago and bought a little copse off the arm of a canal from a farmer he knew. Built a tree house to live in with his collie and had a small barge moored up.
Reckoned he lived off bark ,moss and bream for years. Several times a year he visited a different galaxy , which was unreal so decided to stand as an MP to pass on the vision. Brilliant artist and fantastic wood worker building guitars for commercial sale also.
That was my Green candidate so voted for him
In reply to Post #247
Sounds perfect
Sounds perfect
In reply to Post #156
Straight to the point,
It's OK we are still leveling up
And u can't beat a oven ready turkey
Straight to the point,
It's OK we are still leveling up
And u can't beat a oven ready turkey
In reply to Post #248
Apart from the bream I agree mate
Last bumped into him around Xmas with 2 ladies he'd met on the campaign trail, in a pub around Lymm. He'd moved into a huge house with a merry widow and her spinster sister
No more bream, 3 square a day and they'd built him a workshop in the gardens and still visits other galaxies.
Apart from the bream I agree mate
Last bumped into him around Xmas with 2 ladies he'd met on the campaign trail, in a pub around Lymm. He'd moved into a huge house with a merry widow and her spinster sister
No more bream, 3 square a day and they'd built him a workshop in the gardens and still visits other galaxies.
I see Sunak plans to have our taxes at an all time high. I guess the multi millionaire realises that he can't balance the books of this country with all the scroungers trying to milk it dry, still, he will b OK
Get ready for the NHS going...
His opposition plans to cut cooperation tax, on U.K. businesses, great as a short term boost. Let's tax all the importers, heavily, 25% and then start with corrupt offshore stuff, maybe her mate Sunak, might get a look in
Get ready for the NHS going...
His opposition plans to cut cooperation tax, on U.K. businesses, great as a short term boost. Let's tax all the importers, heavily, 25% and then start with corrupt offshore stuff, maybe her mate Sunak, might get a look in
In reply to Post #251
I'd say that things like tax avoidance and vast amounts of taxpayers money wasted during Covid (PPE, Test and Trace - £37billion) are more of an issue. The "scroungers" in this case are the ones that are siphoning it off from the top.
I'd say that things like tax avoidance and vast amounts of taxpayers money wasted during Covid (PPE, Test and Trace - £37billion) are more of an issue. The "scroungers" in this case are the ones that are siphoning it off from the top.
In reply to Post #252
Saw this today...
This is who is electing our next prime minister.
https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/politics/tory-party-demographics-revealed-ahead-of-leadership-election-and-they-make-for-pretty-grim-reading-329194/
This is who is electing our next prime minister.
https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/politics/tory-party-demographics-revealed-ahead-of-leadership-election-and-they-make-for-pretty-grim-reading-329194/
In reply to Post #254
I read your link and thought it lacked any sources that backed up the claims so I done a bit of research and come up with this
Analysis / Bias
In review, The London Economic has a strong left-wing bias in story selection that always favors the left. They consistently use loaded headlines such as Leaked list of Conservative Party sex pest sleaze published, shaming THIRTY SIX current Tory MPs and this Boris Johnson turns into The Joker in new artwork. While The London Economic mentions their source in articles, they do not provide hyperlinks for further verification of information, which leads to articles being spun and taken out of context.
Editorially, there is consistent liberal bias such as this The Conservatives are taking a sledge hammer to their voter base and this Labour is the only party treating both sides of the Brexit divide with respect. In general, news reporting is mostly factual, but lacks hyperlinked sourcing, while editorial positions always favor the left.
A factual search reveals they have not failed a fact check.
Overall, we rate The London Economic Left Biased based on editorial positions that always favor liberal policies. We also rate them Mostly Factual, rather than High, due to a lack of hyperlinked sourcing. (D. Van Zandt 12/09/2017) Updated (10/12/2019)
I don't know the facts myself but my guess is the Conservatives are mostly made up of 50+ but I wouldn't know what their views are.
In general I think all our voting systems need a overhaul but I can't either see the Tories or Labour wanting that as it favours them both.
It would favour the Greens but also UKIP back in 2015 who came third in terms of votes with 12.6%, but won only one seat.
Edit
When Corbyn was elected they allowed new members to vote, that didn't help Labour.
Seems nothing is perfect.
I read your link and thought it lacked any sources that backed up the claims so I done a bit of research and come up with this
Analysis / Bias
In review, The London Economic has a strong left-wing bias in story selection that always favors the left. They consistently use loaded headlines such as Leaked list of Conservative Party sex pest sleaze published, shaming THIRTY SIX current Tory MPs and this Boris Johnson turns into The Joker in new artwork. While The London Economic mentions their source in articles, they do not provide hyperlinks for further verification of information, which leads to articles being spun and taken out of context.
Editorially, there is consistent liberal bias such as this The Conservatives are taking a sledge hammer to their voter base and this Labour is the only party treating both sides of the Brexit divide with respect. In general, news reporting is mostly factual, but lacks hyperlinked sourcing, while editorial positions always favor the left.
A factual search reveals they have not failed a fact check.
Overall, we rate The London Economic Left Biased based on editorial positions that always favor liberal policies. We also rate them Mostly Factual, rather than High, due to a lack of hyperlinked sourcing. (D. Van Zandt 12/09/2017) Updated (10/12/2019)
I don't know the facts myself but my guess is the Conservatives are mostly made up of 50+ but I wouldn't know what their views are.
In general I think all our voting systems need a overhaul but I can't either see the Tories or Labour wanting that as it favours them both.
It would favour the Greens but also UKIP back in 2015 who came third in terms of votes with 12.6%, but won only one seat.
Edit
When Corbyn was elected they allowed new members to vote, that didn't help Labour.
Seems nothing is perfect.
In reply to Post #255
Fair enough
An increasingly right wing government is always going to provoke a more extreme left wing response I guess.
I've not found anything that directly challenged the figures though.
I agree that our system needs an overhaul. And also that its unlikely that those who benefit from the current one would ever push for a change.
Maybe we need a revolution - you're already dressed for it
Fair enough
An increasingly right wing government is always going to provoke a more extreme left wing response I guess.
I've not found anything that directly challenged the figures though.
I agree that our system needs an overhaul. And also that its unlikely that those who benefit from the current one would ever push for a change.
Maybe we need a revolution - you're already dressed for it
In reply to Post #256
It's all a matter of opinion.
Some say rather than far right and far left the difference between the Tories and Labour has lessened over time.
I'm not sure what I think, I keep changing my mind
It's all a matter of opinion.
Some say rather than far right and far left the difference between the Tories and Labour has lessened over time.
I'm not sure what I think, I keep changing my mind
In reply to Post #257
I don't view the Labour Party as left anymore. They've taken over the ground that the Conservative Party used to occupy, whilst the Tory Party is now just UKIP, with blue rosettes.
I don't view the Labour Party as left anymore. They've taken over the ground that the Conservative Party used to occupy, whilst the Tory Party is now just UKIP, with blue rosettes.
In reply to Post #258
Why bother voting labour when you can have "proper" conservatives.......? I think Starmer will end up being as unpopular as Corbyn but for entirely different reasons. And that won't be good for the country.
Why bother voting labour when you can have "proper" conservatives.......? I think Starmer will end up being as unpopular as Corbyn but for entirely different reasons. And that won't be good for the country.
In reply to Post #258
Lol so your saying as a nation we're right wing ......
Lol so your saying as a nation we're right wing ......
In reply to Post #260
To an extent.....and that FPTP suits less progressive parties.
To an extent.....and that FPTP suits less progressive parties.
Some Tory members that'll be voting on the future of our country want Johnson added to the ballot paper against the dementor Truss and Richy
I'd like Sarina Wiegman added if possible.
Brilliant stuff.
I'd like Sarina Wiegman added if possible.
Brilliant stuff.
In reply to Post #262
How democratic
How democratic
In reply to Post #263
The dementor(when the 160k blue rinse brigade vote her in) will cut the pay of teachers,nurses police officers, firemen, civil servants etc if you work in a deprived area of this country.
That should get her over the line and into the job.
The dementor(when the 160k blue rinse brigade vote her in) will cut the pay of teachers,nurses police officers, firemen, civil servants etc if you work in a deprived area of this country.
That should get her over the line and into the job.
In reply to Post #264
Whilst also bringing in education reforms that reinforce the elitism of the past...
****ing joke
Whilst also bringing in education reforms that reinforce the elitism of the past...
****ing joke
In reply to Post #264
Well that Truss £12 billion flagship policy stood upto scrutiny well. In less than a day it's completely gone
Well that Truss £12 billion flagship policy stood upto scrutiny well. In less than a day it's completely gone
In reply to Post #266
Shes not right in the head 😂
Shes not right in the head 😂
In reply to Post #266
Yep...
She's bloody rubbish
Yep...
She's bloody rubbish
In reply to Post #268
Meanwhile on planet zog...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11073023/Jeremy-Corbyn-condemns-UK-decision-send-weapons-Ukraine.html
Meanwhile on planet zog...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11073023/Jeremy-Corbyn-condemns-UK-decision-send-weapons-Ukraine.html
In reply to Post #269
In reply to Post #269
Once a Russian apologist always a Russian apologist!
Once a Russian apologist always a Russian apologist!
In reply to Post #271
You'd have thought he'd have got on well with Boris eh?
You'd have thought he'd have got on well with Boris eh?
In reply to Post #269
I see his point, sending weapons isn't going to bring peace it's just going to lead to more loss of life.
A cease fire would enable peace talks, if Russia sticks to it.
I see his point, sending weapons isn't going to bring peace it's just going to lead to more loss of life.
A cease fire would enable peace talks, if Russia sticks to it.
In reply to Post #273
It's amazing that people knock him for wanting peace, makes you wonder if the ones doing it want WW3.......
It's amazing that people knock him for wanting peace, makes you wonder if the ones doing it want WW3.......
In reply to Post #273
I don't see his point, I couldn't believe what the silly **** said.
Stop killing the aggressor so they can simply walk in, kill a load of Ukraines and take it.
Maybe the way to a cease fire is to send in more weapons?
I don't see his point, I couldn't believe what the silly **** said.
Stop killing the aggressor so they can simply walk in, kill a load of Ukraines and take it.
Maybe the way to a cease fire is to send in more weapons?
In reply to Post #275
I can't find any reference to him saying to stop killing the aggressors and let Russia have it. From what I've read so far he has said “Pouring arms in isn't going to bring about a solution, it's only going to prolong and exaggerate this war,”
Which is true, we have seen it before in other conflicts. The only way to peace is to talk.
I can't find any reference to him saying to stop killing the aggressors and let Russia have it. From what I've read so far he has said “Pouring arms in isn't going to bring about a solution, it's only going to prolong and exaggerate this war,”
Which is true, we have seen it before in other conflicts. The only way to peace is to talk.
In reply to Post #276
Spot on, however the Daily Heil is always going to frame it in a ludicrously skewed way, it's all they know.
Spot on, however the Daily Heil is always going to frame it in a ludicrously skewed way, it's all they know.
In reply to Post #276
Agreed. He's always right about war, but comes.over as someone that will just roll over. When you've got the Tories flag shagging and acting tough , that's easier to sell than
'wars solve nothing'.
Agreed. He's always right about war, but comes.over as someone that will just roll over. When you've got the Tories flag shagging and acting tough , that's easier to sell than
'wars solve nothing'.
In reply to Post #276
The article starts with
Jeremy Corbyn condemns UK decision to send weapons to Ukraine and the fact 'Russian soldiers are dying'
You read it as you want but the easy way to stop Russian soldiers dying is to withdraw them. Withdraw them and no weapons will be sent.
The article starts with
Jeremy Corbyn condemns UK decision to send weapons to Ukraine and the fact 'Russian soldiers are dying'
You read it as you want but the easy way to stop Russian soldiers dying is to withdraw them. Withdraw them and no weapons will be sent.
In reply to Post #279
Those Russian soldiers are conscripted; I doubt many of them want to be there. They're being killed as a result of Putin's disastrous decision to invade Ukraine. This is far more complex than the simplified framing of it by the Daily Mail.
FWIW, I thought Corbyn was a useless leader of the Labour Party and his sitting on the fence and being non-committal on Brexit will never be forgiven. But absolutely everything he actually says in that interview is spot on. Perpetuating the war should be avoid at all costs, and peace must be the first priority. Hard to disagree with that.
Those Russian soldiers are conscripted; I doubt many of them want to be there. They're being killed as a result of Putin's disastrous decision to invade Ukraine. This is far more complex than the simplified framing of it by the Daily Mail.
FWIW, I thought Corbyn was a useless leader of the Labour Party and his sitting on the fence and being non-committal on Brexit will never be forgiven. But absolutely everything he actually says in that interview is spot on. Perpetuating the war should be avoid at all costs, and peace must be the first priority. Hard to disagree with that.
In reply to Post #280
I agree with much of what you say.
Just think withdrawing help to Ukraine, allowing it to be taken by Russia will just encourage more of the same from the Russians. Who will be next?
I agree with much of what you say.
Just think withdrawing help to Ukraine, allowing it to be taken by Russia will just encourage more of the same from the Russians. Who will be next?
In reply to Post #281
Putin will not stop until he has control of Ukraine he has said that peace talks will not happen
Between the two countries they account for more than 25% of the global wheat supply, so like gas Russia has everything to gain.
Ukraine is rich in many other minerals to quote- coal, iron ore, natural gas, manganese, salt, oil, graphite, sulfur, kaolin, titanium, nickel, magnesium, timber, and mercury, he'll be able to strengthen his position further holding the west to ransom whilst he invades Sweden and Finland allowing this to go on much much longer imho.
Putin will not stop until he has control of Ukraine he has said that peace talks will not happen
Between the two countries they account for more than 25% of the global wheat supply, so like gas Russia has everything to gain.
Ukraine is rich in many other minerals to quote- coal, iron ore, natural gas, manganese, salt, oil, graphite, sulfur, kaolin, titanium, nickel, magnesium, timber, and mercury, he'll be able to strengthen his position further holding the west to ransom whilst he invades Sweden and Finland allowing this to go on much much longer imho.
In reply to Post #281
I'd like to think that this has gone so badly for Putin that he simply wouldn't have the resources nor the backing internally to try it again, but ultimately, I don't know.
I'd like to think that this has gone so badly for Putin that he simply wouldn't have the resources nor the backing internally to try it again, but ultimately, I don't know.
In reply to Post #282
Putin may say that but in reality it's a busted flush standpoint and everyone knows it.
Ukraine will get stronger, every month every year as will NATO. Russia hasn't the resources for a decade long war of attrition, Ukraine has no option so as long as there's weapons and ammunition flowing in the Ukrainians will keep firing them for however long it takes.
Personally I'd keep upping the anti on Putin by every means possible, fair or foul. In his satellite states the lot, til he cracks, which he will.
Putin may say that but in reality it's a busted flush standpoint and everyone knows it.
Ukraine will get stronger, every month every year as will NATO. Russia hasn't the resources for a decade long war of attrition, Ukraine has no option so as long as there's weapons and ammunition flowing in the Ukrainians will keep firing them for however long it takes.
Personally I'd keep upping the anti on Putin by every means possible, fair or foul. In his satellite states the lot, til he cracks, which he will.
In reply to Post #284
What do we really know about Russia ?? Other than what we are told and read and we all know their is a lot of BS out there....
One thing for sure unlike any past aggressors the west has faced in the last 30 years like from the Middle East etc the west has declined getting directly involved in this conflict - to me that says quite enough and clearly no one is underestimating them.
If this conflict continues and forces Germany into a recession the eurozone is going to have one hell of a torrid time.
What do we really know about Russia ?? Other than what we are told and read and we all know their is a lot of BS out there....
One thing for sure unlike any past aggressors the west has faced in the last 30 years like from the Middle East etc the west has declined getting directly involved in this conflict - to me that says quite enough and clearly no one is underestimating them.
If this conflict continues and forces Germany into a recession the eurozone is going to have one hell of a torrid time.
In reply to Post #286
If you've read Russian history over the last 300 years it's not difficult to understand Russia and it's leaders in many guises. Difficult to a degree to predict,but not to understand .As Putin is ex indoctrinated KGB he knows how to play it at home The West also knows how to play him.
I think your misunderstanding the West's involvement, it's heavily involved both militarily and domestically. Far more than the relative sideshows in the middle east with the consequences of funding arming and sanctioning.
They've a long way to fall before they bump into us Germany.
If you've read Russian history over the last 300 years it's not difficult to understand Russia and it's leaders in many guises. Difficult to a degree to predict,but not to understand .As Putin is ex indoctrinated KGB he knows how to play it at home The West also knows how to play him.
I think your misunderstanding the West's involvement, it's heavily involved both militarily and domestically. Far more than the relative sideshows in the middle east with the consequences of funding arming and sanctioning.
They've a long way to fall before they bump into us Germany.
In reply to Post #287
I don't think I've misunderstood anything the west are not directly putting troops on Ukrainian soil or am I wrong ? it's clear what Russia stand to gain as I posted previously.
Apologies I forgot your were an expert on Russian history over the last 300 years
I don't think I've misunderstood anything the west are not directly putting troops on Ukrainian soil or am I wrong ? it's clear what Russia stand to gain as I posted previously.
Apologies I forgot your were an expert on Russian history over the last 300 years
In reply to Post #288
Well now you know.
You don't have to put physical troops on the ground to be involved in and fuel a conflict and weaken an enemy or strengthen your own geopolitical position. Proxy wars have been conducted for centuries,even thousands of years. For many many reasons, resources being well down the list Nothing new .
Well now you know.
You don't have to put physical troops on the ground to be involved in and fuel a conflict and weaken an enemy or strengthen your own geopolitical position. Proxy wars have been conducted for centuries,even thousands of years. For many many reasons, resources being well down the list Nothing new .
In reply to Post #277
And yet Corbynski is speaking on an anti semetic, pro Assad, pro Russian, Hezbolah funded TV station. I bet they were all sipping coffee from Mrs Corbyns unethical coffee company that exploits its workers eh? Hey ho, nowt changes.
And yet Corbynski is speaking on an anti semetic, pro Assad, pro Russian, Hezbolah funded TV station. I bet they were all sipping coffee from Mrs Corbyns unethical coffee company that exploits its workers eh? Hey ho, nowt changes.
In reply to Post #289
It was an expression I thought you would have got that my meaning is that if Russia makes significant gains Ukraine may need the west to directly launch missile strikes.(for example) from Nato countries and I'm not sure if that's a line we'd cross with Russia
It was an expression I thought you would have got that my meaning is that if Russia makes significant gains Ukraine may need the west to directly launch missile strikes.(for example) from Nato countries and I'm not sure if that's a line we'd cross with Russia
In reply to Post #290
I'm sure if you stopped him in the street he'd still give you the same comments as he gave in the interview, which mirrored exactly what he said when the Russian separatist started the initial invasion of Ukraine
I'm sure if you stopped him in the street he'd still give you the same comments as he gave in the interview, which mirrored exactly what he said when the Russian separatist started the initial invasion of Ukraine
In reply to Post #291
There's a storm brewing in the Pacific and it's been the point of a US pivot East for 30 years (Taiwan thread).
Much to the angst of Putin who's machismo and indoctrination will always want Russia to be No1 challenger (it has benefits).
As Wellington did at Waterloo, keep your biggest hitting in reserve til you see where the biggest threat really is. The missiles are there for anyone who wants to take them on buddy, The bad guys know that.
There's a storm brewing in the Pacific and it's been the point of a US pivot East for 30 years (Taiwan thread).
Much to the angst of Putin who's machismo and indoctrination will always want Russia to be No1 challenger (it has benefits).
As Wellington did at Waterloo, keep your biggest hitting in reserve til you see where the biggest threat really is. The missiles are there for anyone who wants to take them on buddy, The bad guys know that.
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