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midlandman

Posts: 3432

#62 5 Jan 2025 at 3.24pm

In reply to Post #61
Fascinating stuff Mark. You are good at translating the complex in a manner that can be understood.

TCarper

Posts: 4033

#61 5 Jan 2025 at 3.00pm

In reply to Post #60
I only became a 'gambler', as I understand the game. What I'm doing is not even gambling. I play the bookies at their own game. Reverse what they do, back onto them. That's all.

I've tried to explain some of that game, just so people understand, that there is a world that they do not understand when it comes to online games for cash. The online poker sites are all rigged at lower stakes. Computer programs, that churn out constant results that defy statistical logic for those that understand. But that absolutely maximise profit for the owners of the computer model. By a high turnover of players paying into new games constantly. That's how they make their money. Russian programmes, on Russian owned sites.

The computerisation of gambling on the internet allows for untold wrong doing that was never possible previously.

The FOBT's I spoke about were computerised, but just before the internet. The damage was seen on our high streets of what these computer programs could do to normally sane people. Turn them into absolute lunatics. It was lucky the internet had never been invented yet, or they would have gone straight online and no one would still be the wiser. What do you think the people who came up with those machines are all up to now? On the internet, away from prying eyes in the main? Those computer programmes will still be running. Just in online casinos, away from prying eyes. Fifteen years on the tech will be far greater too.

Be super careful when playing any comps or monetary gambling when a computer program runs the show. A computer program can be set anyhow the owner decides, at any time too. To an outcome of their choice.

If you chose to believe that goodwill fairies run the gambling on the internet. That's up to you.

116lee

Posts: 187

#60 5 Jan 2025 at 2.18pm

In reply to Post #59
Fascinating stuff mate.Most of it went completely over my head as I'm not a gambler but very interesting all the same.

TCarper

Posts: 4033

#59 5 Jan 2025 at 1.14pm

In reply to Post #51
Quote.... Except they’re not scams. A lot of the cheaper raffles are high odds but that doesn’t make them a scam and no one is forcing anyone to enter them.

You sound like you might have a vested interest Stark. If you do, I'm sure you run a straight game. I'm sure Mark Pitchers etc run a straight game. But don't try to claim that everyone starting up these comp sites does as well. You have simply no clue. Human nature dictates, when there is a chance to rip off fellow man, some one always will.

Legislation will come rapidly for these comp sites that they have so far avoided. That's what happens. That's called life. In the same way someone is always looking to scam their fellow man for money. That's also called life.

I could set up a comp business tomorrow. Pay out the first couple of hundred punters to get a good name... Then make sure my mates win the big prizes and rip everyone off until I'm caught.

Anyway, I have a loaf of bread here. Who wants to buy it for £100?

It's not a scam at all, the percentage is just terrible. No one is forcing anyone to buy it. But if I can convince some stupid people to buy this Asda smart price bread for £100 with a Teflon smile.

Thats's their fault right?

We (carpfishing) should be welcoming newcomers to the pastime. Not ripping them off for instant financial gain. Who does that help in the long run?

TCarper

Posts: 4033

#58 5 Jan 2025 at 11.43am

Lets try to communicate this in a way people understand more simply.

On a roulette wheel in a casino, there are 36 numbers, and 0.

Payout on a single number, is 35-1. Good odds right? It's all an illusion. The 0 is the important factor. 0 plays for the casino. Red and black? To the unassuming everyday punter, this is an EVEN money shot, right? Red or black. You have an even money chance of hitting? WRONG.

0 is for the casino. 0 is all bets void red or black.

This small advantage for the casino in odds, is absolutely massive. It dictates, that you will always lose eventually. You may be lucky, you may have a small run of luck. But in the end... You will lose. Statistics prove that. But the illusion for average Joe, is that it's even money. Average Joe is wrong.

Now imagine putting 36 numbers on the roulette board again, but this time putting 105 zeros on the board. Now play red & black again. That's what you are doing when you play these comps. Pure stupidity. But you can't see it. But the illusion is that you are in with a great chance. Look at all the 0's on the board, then think again.

To take the money from the punter, there always needs to be an 'illusion'. The computerisation of gambling is one of the greatest cons in the history of mankind. In the wild west these people would be shot in the face as thieves. The internet allows a viel of respectability. The fact remains, it's just people preying on vulnerable people. It's always gone on since the dawn of time. It always will.

In a casino there are skilled punters that would read the digital boards at the end of the tables. Looking for weak dealers who spin to repetitive parts of the wheel. Most staff in casinos are extremely pretty young women. There to make you feel good about losing your money. But they will get repetitions in their spins. A skilled punter will watch for this, walk up and place a large bet on that entire section of the wheel knowing she is going to drop the ball there. On a roulette wheel, the croupier has to spin the wheel one way, the ball must go the other. At least three revolutions of the wheel, at least three revolutions of the ball the opposite way. This is to keep things kosher. I was one of the people downstairs waiting to get the money back from punters like the one detailed above. I could spin the ball into the same number, three times on the trot by design. If you have seen the film Rainman, where Dustin Hoffman is autistic, and uses this as a card counter to cheat. Tom Cruise uses him to beat blackjack in a casino. Counting cards. Dustin Hoffman's character is counting through six decks of 52 cards in the film. A standard shoe. I can count cards forever. Through an infinite number of decks of cards. You could take 150 decks of cards, mix them up, go through them at speed one at a time onto the table. With 25 cards left of of the 150 decks, i will tell you exactly how many A, K, Q, J, 10's there are left in the remaining cards. Or how many specific cards under 7 are left. A massive statistical edge for gambling. All is not always as it seems. Casino companies train their elite staff to cheat, far better than any cheat ever could. This is to spot the cheats, or to beat the cheats at their own game when millions of pounds are involved.

The computerisation of gambling, computer programs... This stepped things up to an entire other level than what the human brain can ever be trained to do.

TCarper

Posts: 4033

#57 5 Jan 2025 at 10.51am

In reply to Post #56
Quote.... Bingo also pushes the social aspect…..

It does, it creates something good for the money they take from the market. Bookmakers claim the same about betting shops, but are not allowed to take 200% out of the market.

The lottery was the first legalised gambling, where the odds are so shocking that it's not real. A tax on the stupid as someone else said. They managed this, in the name of charidy. Good causes. Some of the money goes to charidy. It's a legalised con, but it's okay as it supports good causes.....

Now move forwards to these comps. They use the raffle system, to escape legislation designed to protect stupid people.

If that does not set alarm bells ringing, then nothing will.

The FOBT's (Fixed Odds Betting Terminals) were a disgrace. They were quietly banned and removed from our high streets.... But there was never any big hoo haa as to why they were banned. If you remember, it became a regular sight to see crazed men smashing up these FOBT's and the bookmakers shops in which they sat. It became a serious problem. What was triggering them to start smashing everything up? Absolutely losing the plot.

I'll answer your PM here Teddybare. I've got nothing hide, or to prove to you. Of course they have all that you say in your PM. I'm sure you're a feared man to the bookies. The difference between me and you is quite simply his. I have always held a UK gaming licence. I have been trained to the ninth degree in mathematics. I’ve never been able to place a bet with any online betting company in my own name. Not ever. It's actually illegal for me to walk into a UK casino. If I tried, facial recognition would pull me out instantly. I held a UK gaming licence before the internet was ever invented. That holds specific details about my level of training, my skills, who I worked for etc. It tells casinos or gaming companies that I am far from a victim for them. It also tells them that I am far more skilled than any of their traders, at their own job of forming markets.

The real people I used to get around this are all family members. So yes, it was was easy for them to find out who I was. I've played this game for years. Once they found out who I was, I am more valuable to them, than the amount of money which they let me win quite simply. That arrangement could end at any moment. As I pointed out in my initial post, they knew a long time before I knew. They only contacted me when I started to open up more accounts. They had known for a good while already. There are many people on this forum, who witness all this first hand on an ongoing basis. 9 out of 10 horses I point out, half in price by off time. That in itself is a licence to print money on a back to lay system in itself. Val Dancer I pointed out as a recent example, was backed off the boards by traders from the UK's largest bookmakers on the exchanges at the last moment. It was them who forced the price down. 2024 was a great year for me, because of this agreement. It was undoubtably a great year for them too, with information gleaned from me. The fact that what I do, is all 24 hours before the actual race.... Give's them plenty of time to lay off my money, and use the information themselves. I am nothing in comparison to them in money terms. But I bring them benefits that make them a lot of money. What I get from them, is still a pittance compared to what they get from me in terms of value of information for them. All of the larger bookies use winning punters to tell them when they make a mistake in their markets. Bookmakers all price up races the afternoon before the race. So many races/events daily. They have to make the odds for them all. They make bad mistakes. They will lay me up to a couple of grand to win on a horse at 12-1, whose real price is more like 7-1. That information then instantly see’s them fix their mistake. They will then back that horse on the exchanges as well for the company, if enough of their winning punters are on the same horse. Luck comes and goes. Value is constant and always beats luck. The reason the bookies always win in the long run is because they have the value in their markets with their over round. Until they make mistakes. I only bet when they make a mistake. When the odds are in my favour, not theirs.

Before the internet, I was offered a traders job at two of the biggest UK bookmakers, both via shops. I nearly took one of them.

frothey

Posts: 3524

#56 5 Jan 2025 at 9.59am

In reply to Post #46
Bingo also pushes the social aspect…..

Wayne

Posts: 18686

#55 5 Jan 2025 at 8.07am

In reply to Post #54
It won’t…….also means I ain’t lost anything……

Teddybare

Posts: 994

#54 4 Jan 2025 at 9.11pm

In reply to Post #53
But it won't change your life, so 🤷

Wayne

Posts: 18686

#53 4 Jan 2025 at 8.16pm

In reply to Post #49
You could lose a few quid, you could lose hundreds……..you can also win!

Just so happens I won £100 on one of there free comps……..

Teddybare

Posts: 994

#52 4 Jan 2025 at 7.48pm

In reply to Post #48
Sent you a PM

StarkCarp1980

Posts: 106

#51 4 Jan 2025 at 7.40pm

In reply to Post #49
Except they’re not scams. A lot of the cheaper raffles are high odds but that doesn’t make them a scam and no one is forcing anyone to enter them.

Leeroyjenkins

Posts: 3856

#50 4 Jan 2025 at 5.34pm

In reply to Post #49
There are people who pay a monthly fee to find out what biscuits Leon Bartropp has been eating on the bank this week. Nothing can stop this monster.

midlandman

Posts: 3432

#49 4 Jan 2025 at 4.08pm

In reply to Post #35
That was a very interesting post Mark and an insight into a world about which I know very little.

It is time that these competitions were shown up for what they are and the anglers promoting them should also be shown for what they are. The business side of carp Fishing has a corporate face, but it is not preying on us. It is up to us whether we choose to spend our hard earned money on tackle and bait. These competitions, however, are almost the final piss take. Anglers promoting these scams know that the majority of us will lose, and they are simply doing it for their own personal financial benefits. They should be drummed out of our hobby.

Leeroyjenkins

Posts: 3856

#48 4 Jan 2025 at 1.39pm

In reply to Post #42
Devon.

I've started traveling 3+ hours to fish last year, but trying to get your name down for syndicates in areas where you literally don't know anyone is borderline impossible. Especially when I don't want to make friends, I don't want to get to know all the locals to get in the clique, I just want to go fishing.


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