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In reply to Post #18
The thing i like about kelps that it swells quickly and breaks the bait apart.
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In reply to Post #13
Quite frankly if you could afford to put Liver power in the bait it would be churlish not to put Yeast in as well considering the price differential.
Seaweed (kelp is just one type of seaweed and not necessarily the best ) has a place in every type of bait for what it brings at its economical cost ,5% being more than enough nutionally
Yeast being marginally more expensive again has a place in all baits.
Liver brings in quite a lot but is much more expensive to include, by this I am referring to good quality liver powder, not one of the many liquid livers available.
Include these 3 ingredients and you will have covered most if not all the micro ingredients that you have never heard of required by fish and other aquatic life forms, but particularly Carp
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In reply to Post #16
The boiling time will be a big factor as it will firm them up, you could try boiling a few for an extra 30 seconds and then another for 1min and see how they are. Failing that you will need to add a little something to firm them up such as blood hemoglobin or albumen.
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In reply to Post #15
Thanks all, first test batch was a success...
Stuck with original recipe plus 25g mixed spices, basically it's easier for me to remember.
Final offering was this:
500g 50/50 mix
250g Irish fishmeal
100g squid hydroslate
25g spice mix (paprika 22g turmeric 3g)
9eggs with 25ml squid hydroslate
Stinks like hell if I'm honest (lol)
It gunned well, rolling was dodgy ( my fault lesson learnt )
I would say I need to add a bit of something to firm it up...
So just looking at cost of the blood haemoglobin.
Do any of these factors affect their softness when submerged in water:
Boiling time ( I did 90 seconds )?
Could air drying longer help? air dried them long enough (12 hrs ) would that affect their solubility
Mix consistency ?
They were a touch soft after 12 hrs in the drink post being air dried for 12hrs..
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In reply to Post #14
me too personally.
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In reply to Post #13
I’d rather have a bait that did break down quickly…..
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In reply to Post #12
Some great additives for sure and blood hemoglobin is great for hardening and adding protein. I personally would add liver powder over yeast, kelp is a decent cheap additive to add some good vitamins and minerals to a bait but now we are getting into the realm of him having to buy a lot more ingredients which will up the initial out lay.
So in conclusion if you did want to delve into a more complex bait which would still be reasonably cheap and add some of these ingredients I would go for something like this:
400g 50/50 mix (I would make your own as its likely cheaper)
200g Irish Fishmeal
100g Squid meal
75g Soluble milk powder
50g Kelp
75g Blood hemoglobin
50g Paprika
50g Liver powder
25ml liquid squid hydroslate per 500g
This should give you a nice firm, dark red, nutritional bait with a fishmeal/squid meal flavour and a very slightly earthy undertone that has a good leakage but wont break up too quickly. It's funny how a bait formulation can very quickly and easily escalate into sometime more complex. 
But not to put you off if you wanted to keep it simple this original formulation will catch you fish and give nice leakage and a decent nutritional bait. I would firstly make a one egg mix to make sure they roll nicely and test them in a glass of water for 24hrs as I have a suspicion that they may well hold up just fine as is, and if they do roll well and don't go too soft then I would make the rest of the batch, if they roll well but go soft over 24hrs then you could make a 1 egg mix with some egg albumen for harder hookbaits and leave the free offerings as is so that they have high leakage and higher breakdown rate, or if you want them all firmer then add egg albumen or blood powder to the whole batch:
500g 50/50 base mix
250g Irish fishmeal
100g squid meal
100g Soluble milk powder
50g paprika
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I would suggest the addition of one of these Egg albumen ,Whey Protein concentrate ,Plasma powder , or Blood Haemoglobin.
This will be an aid to rolling ,and will make a firmer bait ,its break down time will be extended when in the water. As for leakage it will not stop it leaking solubles from the bait .
As the intention is to make a "cheap" but effective bait the obvious choice will be Blood Haemoglobin , this will firm up the bait ,make it dark ,it is very high protein ,liked by a lot of species of fish at low inclusion level.
There are lots of other ingredients that could be added some of which will improve this bait and some which may well be a complete waste of money but with the addition suggested above this will go out of a stick and should also reduce the requirement of a separate hook bait as the original mix is unlikely to last very long on a hair.
I would personally add some Yeast powder and some Seaweed meal to this as both those only need to be added at low level and will increase the nutritional attraction of this bait.
If oil is required simply use some Sunflower or rapeseed oil from any supermarket.
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In reply to Post #10
My suggestion was based on his dry recipe, he was looking to add the following to the base mix:
"Liquids 25ml liquid squid hydroslate plus 8eggs" which is a great addition for winter.
I agree the liquid content could be increased, though he is also looking to keep the cost down, 25ml/500g is the recommended inclusion rate so I don't think he will go far wrong with that.
Another alternative that would be a good cheap liquid to include along side the Hydroslate would be fish sauce from the supermarket.
If you did want to go the oil route winterized salmon oil is great or just standard hemp oil.
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In reply to Post #9
I think that this is good advice, only addition I would add an additional 25 or even 50ml of liquid at this time of year that would definitely be corn steep liquor.
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In reply to Post #8
if you used about 10% milk powder to the below recipe it would be a good inclusion rate without stopping them from binding or being too soft.
You could always spice it up a little and add a load more attraction with paprika (I highly rate paprika especially in winter), something like this would be a cheap and decent bait:
500g 50/50 base mix
250g Irish fishmeal
100g squid meal
100g Soluble milk powder
50g paprika
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In reply to Post #7
Soluble milk powder from a supermarket etc.. at what volumes in the below ?
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In reply to Post #6
If you are using it in winter I would avoid oils unless they are winterized, even then it should be used sparingly. I would personally add some vitamealo or soluble milk powder in there to give the bait itself a bit more leakage so that the liquids etc. aren't as sealed into the bait.
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In reply to Post #4
Would you put in more liquids , like a second oil etc.. after I've air dried I was gonna glug them in tuna glug and freeze
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In reply to Post #2
Yeh the reason I decided not to is because this allows me to use everything in tenths from bulk ( so 10 batches ), when I add eggs it should come out to roughly 1.2kg
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In reply to Post #1
It's basic with a low amount of soluble ingredients so wont have much leakage but will catch fish if applied and used correctly.
You will also need more than 8 eggs for 850g of base mix.
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In reply to Post #1
You might want to consider making the mix up to 1kg or down to 500g just for ease
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Right finally made a decent order of ingredients
This is what I'm going in with for my first attempt :
solids
500g 50/50 base mix
250g Irish fishmeal
100g squid meal
Liquids
25ml liquid squid hydroslate plus 8eggs
Anyone see any issues with the above ? I know it's not a science and I might get it wrong but boiling until they float hopefully they are usable..
I think I've got the ratios about right and it should be cheap as chips if it works
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