In reply to Post #1
JUST out of interest
In 2007 I was fishing an off the radar lake in mid France
it was French owned and fished almost exclusively by French anglers and I was on it for 14 days after the first week I had only had a couple of fish while the french guys were really doing well one of them from a couple of pegs away that spoke perfect English came round for a chat at the end of the first week
and as he was leaving gave me almost a bucket of mini tigers they were about pea size he explained
we are not like you english and dutch we cannot afford the 10 and 20kg expensive boiles you bring !
so we ALL use the mini Tigers so many go every day for the past few years and the fish maybe see them almost like a natural
we vary the flavour of course for the hook baits otherwise it would be like fishing a blade of grass in a pasture
so this is why there are now pineapple flavoured hookbaits in the separate bag !!
well I ended the trip with 3 fish the 1st week on boiles and 15 fish the second week all on the tigers except 1
HOWEVER !!!!
I believe this was a truly unique situation
and I do not believe in heavy baiting with Tigers at all in the UK EVER !!! ............... I happily fish tigers over hemp or spod mix etc especially flavoured peppermint ,pineapple ,strawberry coca cola etc
as IMO your cutting your throat by dumping lots of tigers in UK waters where its obvious the sheer amount of boiles going into our lakes and rivers the fish instantly recognise its a great food source
JUST out of interest
In 2007 I was fishing an off the radar lake in mid France
it was French owned and fished almost exclusively by French anglers and I was on it for 14 days after the first week I had only had a couple of fish while the french guys were really doing well one of them from a couple of pegs away that spoke perfect English came round for a chat at the end of the first week
and as he was leaving gave me almost a bucket of mini tigers they were about pea size he explained
we are not like you english and dutch we cannot afford the 10 and 20kg expensive boiles you bring !
so we ALL use the mini Tigers so many go every day for the past few years and the fish maybe see them almost like a natural
we vary the flavour of course for the hook baits otherwise it would be like fishing a blade of grass in a pasture
so this is why there are now pineapple flavoured hookbaits in the separate bag !!
well I ended the trip with 3 fish the 1st week on boiles and 15 fish the second week all on the tigers except 1
HOWEVER !!!!
I believe this was a truly unique situation
and I do not believe in heavy baiting with Tigers at all in the UK EVER !!! ............... I happily fish tigers over hemp or spod mix etc especially flavoured peppermint ,pineapple ,strawberry coca cola etc
as IMO your cutting your throat by dumping lots of tigers in UK waters where its obvious the sheer amount of boiles going into our lakes and rivers the fish instantly recognise its a great food source
Heavy baiting with Tigers I think you are wasting your time. Carp absolutely love them. But I do think they struggle to eat them in any quantity. Far to much effort involved far easier meals out there.. 
I don't believe that feeding on quantities of tiger nuts has as detrimental an effect on carp as we have been lead to believe. I would question why people continue to peddle that as fact?
A tiger nut does not have a large percentage of protein. That does not mean that there is no nutrition in a tiger nut. They do contain carbohydrate, fats, sugars and a vitamins and minerals.
It's funny that those who pushed the HNV theory (while launching a bait company selling HNV ingredients) based the theory on nutritional recognition. They used their positions in the angling press to demonise the use of baits like peanuts and tiger nuts due to the 'lack of nutrition' in these baits. The real issue was that they couldn't sell you milks and fishmeal if you were happy catching on cheap and natural baits like tigers and nuts.
If a fish is drawn to eat a bait through nutritional recognition, why would they eat themselves to death with 'zero nutrition' tiger nuts?!
I do believe that if you chuck in more than gets eaten that it could sour a spot. They absolutely stink when they float up rotten.
A tiger nut does not have a large percentage of protein. That does not mean that there is no nutrition in a tiger nut. They do contain carbohydrate, fats, sugars and a vitamins and minerals.
It's funny that those who pushed the HNV theory (while launching a bait company selling HNV ingredients) based the theory on nutritional recognition. They used their positions in the angling press to demonise the use of baits like peanuts and tiger nuts due to the 'lack of nutrition' in these baits. The real issue was that they couldn't sell you milks and fishmeal if you were happy catching on cheap and natural baits like tigers and nuts.
If a fish is drawn to eat a bait through nutritional recognition, why would they eat themselves to death with 'zero nutrition' tiger nuts?!
I do believe that if you chuck in more than gets eaten that it could sour a spot. They absolutely stink when they float up rotten.
In reply to Post #18
Agreed and many fisheries banned nuts claiming people weren't preparing them properly but fact is fish rarely get to be obese on naturals . Let's be honest many of the big fish we see pictured are over weight with huge guts and this must be bad for their health over all samee as it is for humans.
Agreed and many fisheries banned nuts claiming people weren't preparing them properly but fact is fish rarely get to be obese on naturals . Let's be honest many of the big fish we see pictured are over weight with huge guts and this must be bad for their health over all samee as it is for humans.
In reply to Post #18
Quote: "A tiger nut does not have a large percentage of protein. That does not mean that there is no nutrition in a tiger nut. They do contain carbohydrate, fats, sugars and a vitamins and minerals."
Just because tigers cntain these Base ingredients it doesn't mean they can then be digested by a car as they do not have the required acid based stomach to digest and then absorb these nutrients.
Quote: "A tiger nut does not have a large percentage of protein. That does not mean that there is no nutrition in a tiger nut. They do contain carbohydrate, fats, sugars and a vitamins and minerals."
Just because tigers cntain these Base ingredients it doesn't mean they can then be digested by a car as they do not have the required acid based stomach to digest and then absorb these nutrients.
In reply to Post #1
Last year as it happens. The results were amazing. The carp were clearly loving the tigers. If someone shows me some robust evidence that, properly prepared, they're a detriment to carp then I'll reconsider...
Last year as it happens. The results were amazing. The carp were clearly loving the tigers. If someone shows me some robust evidence that, properly prepared, they're a detriment to carp then I'll reconsider...
In reply to Post #18
Lad in the year above me did his dissertation on growth rates of small carp fed different food items, fun fact. the best of the lot was peanuts! shelf life boilies from a major retailer came 3rd.
Carp pellet second.
Tells you a lot about the power of the peanut eh, and also what goes in to some boilies.
There is a lot out there on peanuts and other nuts in scientific journals, and lets not forget that the nut meals and liquids are all made from nuts that are banned on a lot of places.
I am sure nuts get demonised by those that use them very effectively too, to keep it an edge for them.
I'm not a nut fishing expert, I use tigers, have dabbled with peanuts and brazils with limited success. A few anglers I know use them a lot and do extremely well.
Lad in the year above me did his dissertation on growth rates of small carp fed different food items, fun fact. the best of the lot was peanuts! shelf life boilies from a major retailer came 3rd.
Carp pellet second.
Tells you a lot about the power of the peanut eh, and also what goes in to some boilies.
There is a lot out there on peanuts and other nuts in scientific journals, and lets not forget that the nut meals and liquids are all made from nuts that are banned on a lot of places.
I am sure nuts get demonised by those that use them very effectively too, to keep it an edge for them.
I'm not a nut fishing expert, I use tigers, have dabbled with peanuts and brazils with limited success. A few anglers I know use them a lot and do extremely well.
In reply to Post #20
Correct, a carp does not have an acidic stomach like ours.
It does have teeth, a (relatively) long digestive tract and a pancreas to produce the enzymes required to break down carbohydrates, fats and protein.
They wouldn't have evolved very far as an omnivore without the ability to digest carbohydrates.
Correct, a carp does not have an acidic stomach like ours.
It does have teeth, a (relatively) long digestive tract and a pancreas to produce the enzymes required to break down carbohydrates, fats and protein.
They wouldn't have evolved very far as an omnivore without the ability to digest carbohydrates.
In reply to Post #18
I think we, as in many anglers, are missing points in the 'theory of nutritional recognition', dependent on types of water, from rich lakes with plenty of food and overstocked lakes with limited quantities of natural food; waters where carp need bait to survive, and so eat almost everything, and where carp have gone off tiger nuts, or possibly where carp have recognised that the tigers are not a nutritional food.
Whether nutritional recognition is valid theory, fact or fiction, there are some fish that don't eat bait, or boilies, some fish only eat natural food, bloodworm, shrimp or snails. They may eat particles, but avoid boilies, or conversely avoid particles but eat boilies, I've seen both, or all over 35years of fishing.
Tiger nuts and peanuts both contain enzyme inhibitors which prevent the utilisation of nutrients from them, with both the effective nutrition is only 'taken' from the surface of the particle. The pharyngeal teeth will crush them, the surface area is then enlarged, swallowed and then passed out as it stands, in fish, and humans. Digestibility is not brilliant, and the protein level is around 8%.
There are some food or food items that are 'addictive', in carp or human terms. I could mention the Supersize me Macdonalds burger for some, for me it is peanuts and tiger nuts. At a party if there is a bowl of peanuts, either plain or dry toasted, or at home a bowl of prepared tigers, despite knowing that next day I will be excreting them crunched in pieces, I will continue to munch them until the bowl is finished. I have the power, (just about) of cognitive thinking, I can choose to eat or leave them, at a pub or bar it is leave them for hygiene reasons.
To carp the 'addiction' can't be thought about, they just eat them, whether they are excreted, covered in uric acid, fresh from the tub or cooker.
The simple answer is that tiger nuts only need to be used in minimal amounts see the 'Jim Gibbinson rule' in my previous post.
I don't believe that feeding on quantities of tiger nuts has as detrimental an effect on carp as we have been lead to believe. I would question why people continue to peddle that as fact?
A tiger nut does not have a large percentage of protein. That does not mean that there is no nutrition in a tiger nut. They do contain carbohydrate, fats, sugars and a vitamins and minerals.
It's funny that those who pushed the HNV theory (while launching a bait company selling HNV ingredients) based the theory on nutritional recognition. They used their positions in the angling press to demonise the use of baits like peanuts and tiger nuts due to the 'lack of nutrition' in these baits. The real issue was that they couldn't sell you milks and fishmeal if you were happy catching on cheap and natural baits like tigers and nuts.
If a fish is drawn to eat a bait through nutritional recognition, why would they eat themselves to death with 'zero nutrition' tiger nuts?!
I do believe that if you chuck in more than gets eaten that it could sour a spot. They absolutely stink when they float up rotten.
I think we, as in many anglers, are missing points in the 'theory of nutritional recognition', dependent on types of water, from rich lakes with plenty of food and overstocked lakes with limited quantities of natural food; waters where carp need bait to survive, and so eat almost everything, and where carp have gone off tiger nuts, or possibly where carp have recognised that the tigers are not a nutritional food.
Whether nutritional recognition is valid theory, fact or fiction, there are some fish that don't eat bait, or boilies, some fish only eat natural food, bloodworm, shrimp or snails. They may eat particles, but avoid boilies, or conversely avoid particles but eat boilies, I've seen both, or all over 35years of fishing.
Tiger nuts and peanuts both contain enzyme inhibitors which prevent the utilisation of nutrients from them, with both the effective nutrition is only 'taken' from the surface of the particle. The pharyngeal teeth will crush them, the surface area is then enlarged, swallowed and then passed out as it stands, in fish, and humans. Digestibility is not brilliant, and the protein level is around 8%.
There are some food or food items that are 'addictive', in carp or human terms. I could mention the Supersize me Macdonalds burger for some, for me it is peanuts and tiger nuts. At a party if there is a bowl of peanuts, either plain or dry toasted, or at home a bowl of prepared tigers, despite knowing that next day I will be excreting them crunched in pieces, I will continue to munch them until the bowl is finished. I have the power, (just about) of cognitive thinking, I can choose to eat or leave them, at a pub or bar it is leave them for hygiene reasons.
To carp the 'addiction' can't be thought about, they just eat them, whether they are excreted, covered in uric acid, fresh from the tub or cooker.
The simple answer is that tiger nuts only need to be used in minimal amounts see the 'Jim Gibbinson rule' in my previous post.
I don't believe that feeding on quantities of tiger nuts has as detrimental an effect on carp as we have been lead to believe. I would question why people continue to peddle that as fact?
A tiger nut does not have a large percentage of protein. That does not mean that there is no nutrition in a tiger nut. They do contain carbohydrate, fats, sugars and a vitamins and minerals.
It's funny that those who pushed the HNV theory (while launching a bait company selling HNV ingredients) based the theory on nutritional recognition. They used their positions in the angling press to demonise the use of baits like peanuts and tiger nuts due to the 'lack of nutrition' in these baits. The real issue was that they couldn't sell you milks and fishmeal if you were happy catching on cheap and natural baits like tigers and nuts.
If a fish is drawn to eat a bait through nutritional recognition, why would they eat themselves to death with 'zero nutrition' tiger nuts?!
I do believe that if you chuck in more than gets eaten that it could sour a spot. They absolutely stink when they float up rotten.
In reply to Post #20
Tiger nuts - Sweet & Fermented Sugars,
They taste nice to us, and, maybe the carp just like eating them regardless.
Another plus they pass through them quickly and don't fill them up.
Tiger nuts - Sweet & Fermented Sugars,
They taste nice to us, and, maybe the carp just like eating them regardless.
Another plus they pass through them quickly and don't fill them up.