In reply to Post #14
I have never dabbled with a milky bait, but I remember many of the fans (back in the day) mentioned better results cutting the hi-nu-val 50/50 with the yellow birdy mix.
I have never dabbled with a milky bait, but I remember many of the fans (back in the day) mentioned better results cutting the hi-nu-val 50/50 with the yellow birdy mix.
In reply to Post #15
definitely something that is affected by water temps too.
the colder it is, the less protein they need & whilst they will seek out higher protein baits, they won't need to eat as many of them - as has been mentioned - less is more when the temps drop.
definitely something that is affected by water temps too.
the colder it is, the less protein they need & whilst they will seek out higher protein baits, they won't need to eat as many of them - as has been mentioned - less is more when the temps drop.
In reply to Post #17
Use it as a paste or wrap....
Use it as a paste or wrap....
Deffo affected by water temps also I agree.
My current base mix (since the mid-90's) is as follows :-
Rennet Casein. 500g
Acid Casein. 500g
Calcium Caseinate. 1000g
Lamlac. 1000g
WPC 80. 500g
Nectarblend. 2000g
PTX. 1000ge S
CLO. 1000g
Robin Red. 2000g
Liver Powder, Bovine. 500g
To each 500g of base I add 5g of garlic powder - use 350g of egg (or close to) , add 20 ml Sunflower Oil and 3 drops Garlic EA. Normally roll as 12mm , 45 second boil. Nicely skinned , soft-centred.
Has caught everywhere I've taken it , even in the depths of winter - protein content is around 38% or so
Rennet Casein. 500g
Acid Casein. 500g
Calcium Caseinate. 1000g
Lamlac. 1000g
WPC 80. 500g
Nectarblend. 2000g
PTX. 1000ge S
CLO. 1000g
Robin Red. 2000g
Liver Powder, Bovine. 500g
To each 500g of base I add 5g of garlic powder - use 350g of egg (or close to) , add 20 ml Sunflower Oil and 3 drops Garlic EA. Normally roll as 12mm , 45 second boil. Nicely skinned , soft-centred.
Has caught everywhere I've taken it , even in the depths of winter - protein content is around 38% or so
It would be interesting to be able to compare catch rates on a water, over say a year. Using 2 baits which are essentially the same but one with maximum protein content & one with reduced protein content.
In reply to Post #20
I know it's a good bait just by looking at the ingredients, but I bet it's expensive. Still if you're making it yourself its part of the experience of carp fishing as a whole, as it was 40 years ago. More power to your elbow.
I know it's a good bait just by looking at the ingredients, but I bet it's expensive. Still if you're making it yourself its part of the experience of carp fishing as a whole, as it was 40 years ago. More power to your elbow.
In reply to Post #21
then compare them to a crap bait full of taste enhancers & processed ingredients.
plenty of proof that big fish eat the meals that give them the easiest access to their nutritional requirements but there is a lot more to it than protein content - just cos there's protein doesn't mean they want to eat it. HNV does not mean high protein but a lot of carpers are still stuck in their ways, just because someone wrote a theory on it 50 years ago.
science around carp nutrition has come on leaps & bounds in the last 50 years but for some strange reason, carp anglers seem stuck in their ways & are happy to ignore a lot of it.
then compare them to a crap bait full of taste enhancers & processed ingredients.
plenty of proof that big fish eat the meals that give them the easiest access to their nutritional requirements but there is a lot more to it than protein content - just cos there's protein doesn't mean they want to eat it. HNV does not mean high protein but a lot of carpers are still stuck in their ways, just because someone wrote a theory on it 50 years ago.
science around carp nutrition has come on leaps & bounds in the last 50 years but for some strange reason, carp anglers seem stuck in their ways & are happy to ignore a lot of it.
In reply to Post #22
The ingredients to make 10K of base mix cost £106 - taking into account cost of eggs , oils and gas for the boiling a kilo of finished bait comes out at around £10.50 . I'm happy to pay that
The ingredients to make 10K of base mix cost £106 - taking into account cost of eggs , oils and gas for the boiling a kilo of finished bait comes out at around £10.50 . I'm happy to pay that
In reply to Post #24
Some top end ingredients in there, nice mix - I bet it catches. Thanks for sharing!
have you noticed any difference in the changes to the Robin Red over the years given the higher level you use it at and the talked about changes?
Do you tweak the oil levels for winter use or carry the recipie consistently all the way through?
Some top end ingredients in there, nice mix - I bet it catches. Thanks for sharing!
have you noticed any difference in the changes to the Robin Red over the years given the higher level you use it at and the talked about changes?
Do you tweak the oil levels for winter use or carry the recipie consistently all the way through?
In reply to Post #25
Thanks Andy - I make no changes at all , exactly the same all year round. The 20ml of Sunflower Oil is just to help with rolling a little
If the changes to Robin Red have made any difference it can only be minimal , I've certainly not noticed any difference - I do only use the "Hookbait" version though
It's an expensive bait to make , but not to use because you just don't need to pile in kilos of it - a couple of dozen 12mm baits is enough to start with , then top up after each bite. I go fishing to catch them , not to feed them !!
Thanks Andy - I make no changes at all , exactly the same all year round. The 20ml of Sunflower Oil is just to help with rolling a little
If the changes to Robin Red have made any difference it can only be minimal , I've certainly not noticed any difference - I do only use the "Hookbait" version though
It's an expensive bait to make , but not to use because you just don't need to pile in kilos of it - a couple of dozen 12mm baits is enough to start with , then top up after each bite. I go fishing to catch them , not to feed them !!
In reply to Post #24
That's interesting but aren't you getting nearer 15kg of finished bait out of 10kg dry?
Regardless it shows that good bait is very expensive. Most rolled baits you can get for ‘about' £6 kilo rolled and so assume that these are being produced at £3-4. Yes they get bulk discounts but would imagine that ‘the best' available commercial bait should cost near £25kg shows that we are not prepared to spend that - which is fair enough.
I need to price up some of the old Geoff Kemp recipes in todays market and see how they fair.
That's interesting but aren't you getting nearer 15kg of finished bait out of 10kg dry?
Regardless it shows that good bait is very expensive. Most rolled baits you can get for ‘about' £6 kilo rolled and so assume that these are being produced at £3-4. Yes they get bulk discounts but would imagine that ‘the best' available commercial bait should cost near £25kg shows that we are not prepared to spend that - which is fair enough.
I need to price up some of the old Geoff Kemp recipes in todays market and see how they fair.
In reply to Post #20
Whose Garlic powder & Garlic EA do you use?
Whose Garlic powder & Garlic EA do you use?
I'm not saying they won't catch.
I'm putting it out there that possibly catch rates could increase with a lower protein version of the bait on the same water.
Good Luck with the mix.
I'm putting it out there that possibly catch rates could increase with a lower protein version of the bait on the same water.
Good Luck with the mix.
In reply to Post #27
I've just reviewed the costs , and have been very pleased with the end result - it turns out to be a little cheaper than I thought !!
The latest 10K of base mix ingredients have cost me £119.12 , so here are my calculations
500g base 5.96
Eggs 2.00
Garlic Powder 0.15
Garlic EO 0.02
Sunflower Oil 0.04
Total items cost 8.17 (per mix)
Gas 0.23 (nicely rounds-up the cost)
TOTAL 8.40
This produces 875 grammes of rolled bait (this is the weight after a couple of hours drying , which I find sufficient to make the bait work how I want it to)
So, 840 divided by 875 , multiplied by 1000 gives a cost per kilo of rolled bait of £9.60 . I reckon that's not bad at all
I've just reviewed the costs , and have been very pleased with the end result - it turns out to be a little cheaper than I thought !!
The latest 10K of base mix ingredients have cost me £119.12 , so here are my calculations
500g base 5.96
Eggs 2.00
Garlic Powder 0.15
Garlic EO 0.02
Sunflower Oil 0.04
Total items cost 8.17 (per mix)
Gas 0.23 (nicely rounds-up the cost)
TOTAL 8.40
This produces 875 grammes of rolled bait (this is the weight after a couple of hours drying , which I find sufficient to make the bait work how I want it to)
So, 840 divided by 875 , multiplied by 1000 gives a cost per kilo of rolled bait of £9.60 . I reckon that's not bad at all