I can honestly say I have never purchased a leadclip.
I have about 15-20 in my tackle box though, every single one of which I have found, or retrieved from snags, many with leads still attached!
ESP, Korda, Fox.
The only reason they are still in there is I didn't fancy dumping them in the rubbish, and I'm too lazy to clean the box out
Years ago, I proved to myself, and mates, that helicopter rigs provide reduced indication. It has become a debate on here!
Occasionally I use helicopter set-ups, but rarely.
Wherever possible I prefer to use running leads, plain basic run ring to quicklink, but should I ever need to drop a lead, use a paper clip.
I have about 15-20 in my tackle box though, every single one of which I have found, or retrieved from snags, many with leads still attached!
ESP, Korda, Fox.
The only reason they are still in there is I didn't fancy dumping them in the rubbish, and I'm too lazy to clean the box out
Years ago, I proved to myself, and mates, that helicopter rigs provide reduced indication. It has become a debate on here!
Occasionally I use helicopter set-ups, but rarely.
Wherever possible I prefer to use running leads, plain basic run ring to quicklink, but should I ever need to drop a lead, use a paper clip.
In reply to Post #16
Surely if the top bead is only 3-5” up and the leads plugged 2-3” it will provide very good bite indication. I try to set the bead To suit the substrate as best as possible. I use a heli set up 95% of my angling as it's mainly weed or silt and have never suffered poor bite indication. I get liners when there in the area, And screaming takes on slack lines.
What advantage does a running set up have ? This isn't an argument response I'm just interested as I've only used them for barbel fishing personally.
Surely if the top bead is only 3-5” up and the leads plugged 2-3” it will provide very good bite indication. I try to set the bead To suit the substrate as best as possible. I use a heli set up 95% of my angling as it's mainly weed or silt and have never suffered poor bite indication. I get liners when there in the area, And screaming takes on slack lines.
What advantage does a running set up have ? This isn't an argument response I'm just interested as I've only used them for barbel fishing personally.
all depends if you need to use them or not
In reply to Post #17
If your lead buries into silt the indication you get is sometimes a bow being formed between the rod tip and lead. The fish may dislodge the top bead and run back up the line with just a few bleeps, meaning unplugging the lead and winding down until you get proper contact. A running lead has an anchor point and gives indication regardless of which way the fish goes, sometimes on a drop back type bite the lead will move but the initial indication means you don't have to fish ping tight and cut lines through patrol routes.
I think that does make it less likely a heli set up can be ‘thrown' like a lead clip/in-line but still not a efficiently as a running lead and with more potential slack before full contact.
Imo a good angler will use what suits the situation. If 95% of peoples fishing is with a lead clip I'd hazard a guess that 95% of the fishing they do is on the same or similar types of water. Or that between 0 and 95% of their fishing would suit a different approach but you ain't impressing anyone without a Ronnie gti German half withy helicopter rigged rod leaning on your shelter.
If your lead buries into silt the indication you get is sometimes a bow being formed between the rod tip and lead. The fish may dislodge the top bead and run back up the line with just a few bleeps, meaning unplugging the lead and winding down until you get proper contact. A running lead has an anchor point and gives indication regardless of which way the fish goes, sometimes on a drop back type bite the lead will move but the initial indication means you don't have to fish ping tight and cut lines through patrol routes.
I think that does make it less likely a heli set up can be ‘thrown' like a lead clip/in-line but still not a efficiently as a running lead and with more potential slack before full contact.
Imo a good angler will use what suits the situation. If 95% of peoples fishing is with a lead clip I'd hazard a guess that 95% of the fishing they do is on the same or similar types of water. Or that between 0 and 95% of their fishing would suit a different approach but you ain't impressing anyone without a Ronnie gti German half withy helicopter rigged rod leaning on your shelter.
In reply to Post #17
022 23:31:25In reply to Post #16
Surely if the top bead is only 3-5” up and the leads plugged 2-3” it will provide very good bite indication. I try to set the bead To suit the substrate as best as possible. I use a heli set up 95% of my angling as it's mainly weed or silt and have never suffered poor bite indication. I get liners when there in the area, And screaming takes on slack lines.
What advantage does a running set up have ? This isn't an argument response I'm just interested as I've only used them for barbel fishing personally
I love the comment, 'have never suffered poor bite indication'. Have you seen EVERY take?
You only get screaming takes when the fish decide to run, yet some of your liners, bleeps, twitches of the indicators are likely your rig being taken and ejected. Even more so with a slack line!
The fish have the length of your rig length to move, AND the distance of your top and bottom stop.
A running lead, with a run ring, either with a slack, or tight line, gives you the benefit of the fish having the length of the rig to move, (decreased if you have straightened your rig), and with a slack line, they CAN'T use the weight of the lead to eject the rig.
With a tight line, it becomes a bolt rig.
022 23:31:25In reply to Post #16
Surely if the top bead is only 3-5” up and the leads plugged 2-3” it will provide very good bite indication. I try to set the bead To suit the substrate as best as possible. I use a heli set up 95% of my angling as it's mainly weed or silt and have never suffered poor bite indication. I get liners when there in the area, And screaming takes on slack lines.
What advantage does a running set up have ? This isn't an argument response I'm just interested as I've only used them for barbel fishing personally
I love the comment, 'have never suffered poor bite indication'. Have you seen EVERY take?
You only get screaming takes when the fish decide to run, yet some of your liners, bleeps, twitches of the indicators are likely your rig being taken and ejected. Even more so with a slack line!
The fish have the length of your rig length to move, AND the distance of your top and bottom stop.
A running lead, with a run ring, either with a slack, or tight line, gives you the benefit of the fish having the length of the rig to move, (decreased if you have straightened your rig), and with a slack line, they CAN'T use the weight of the lead to eject the rig.
With a tight line, it becomes a bolt rig.
In reply to Post #16
How did you prove to your mates about helicopter rigs and the Reduced indication?
How did you prove to your mates about helicopter rigs and the Reduced indication?
In reply to Post #20
Can't see every take no 100% but using hand sharpened hooks and blow back rigs you do get to see if the rigs been done or ejected.
Can't see every take no 100% but using hand sharpened hooks and blow back rigs you do get to see if the rigs been done or ejected.
In reply to Post #21
I must admit when I was using/ use a helicopter setup my takes where never what I call screaming takes it was only ever a couple bleeps and had to watch the line and rod tip. Gone back to a lead clip and on the same lake the indication seems a lot better
I must admit when I was using/ use a helicopter setup my takes where never what I call screaming takes it was only ever a couple bleeps and had to watch the line and rod tip. Gone back to a lead clip and on the same lake the indication seems a lot better
If anybody wants to know what really happens underwater (not on the bankside showing your mates) the 100% proof is online with Rob Hughes videos when he goes underwater with his cameras and scuba gear , he shows indication with various rigs and different tension of the lines . There's no hearsay required , it may open your eyes on presentation , it did for me
I have to say I find deciding what lead arrangement to use is my biggest head scratcher. Over recent seasons I've hit upon a rig that I have complete confidence in but I chop and change how I set my leader up. I generally move around and try and find fish with minimal gear (rarely fish nights as I simply don't enjoy the bulk) so I have most confidence in a helicopter style setup as I feel it's ‘fishing' more often than not. However I really don't think it can possibly give the best bite indication or hooking potential. I try and cast as little as possible as I want to be as stealthy as I can. Are people happy fishing for ‘drops' with a lead clip setup and a balanced style bait?
In reply to Post #25
I like the 'convenience' of lead clips more than anything else but I have been fishing a water where anything over 1.5oz has to be dropped. With the lake having a primarily hard bottom I've been using 5oz plus leads and MCF dumper clips with a stiff rig and the hooking ratio is good - on a tight clutch no real screaming takes but a few bleeps / nodding rod tip and the fish is pretty much already hooked before you pick up the rod.
Also use drop off inlines with bags and on this basis have been messing with DIY cog leads more recently on bait boat presentations. . .no real noticeable difference in terms of hooking ratio vs a standard clip but hopefully time will tell whether the faff is worth it . . .
I like the 'convenience' of lead clips more than anything else but I have been fishing a water where anything over 1.5oz has to be dropped. With the lake having a primarily hard bottom I've been using 5oz plus leads and MCF dumper clips with a stiff rig and the hooking ratio is good - on a tight clutch no real screaming takes but a few bleeps / nodding rod tip and the fish is pretty much already hooked before you pick up the rod.
Also use drop off inlines with bags and on this basis have been messing with DIY cog leads more recently on bait boat presentations. . .no real noticeable difference in terms of hooking ratio vs a standard clip but hopefully time will tell whether the faff is worth it . . .
In reply to Post #21
#16
How did you prove to your mates about helicopter rigs and the Reduced indication?
By casting rigs out to the Far margins, or onto the bank and lowering them in, then with them staying by the rod after the indicators were set, going round and moving the rig, and the lead. Waders were worn!
On a 40metre distance, leads could be moved approximately 6metres if the lead was moved in an arc.
At Nazeing, on a 120metre cast a fish made it 30 metres to the island with only a couple of bleeps.
#16
How did you prove to your mates about helicopter rigs and the Reduced indication?
By casting rigs out to the Far margins, or onto the bank and lowering them in, then with them staying by the rod after the indicators were set, going round and moving the rig, and the lead. Waders were worn!
On a 40metre distance, leads could be moved approximately 6metres if the lead was moved in an arc.
At Nazeing, on a 120metre cast a fish made it 30 metres to the island with only a couple of bleeps.
In reply to Post #27
Surely that's down to indicator set up rather then lead arrangement
Surely that's down to indicator set up rather then lead arrangement
In reply to Post #27
It sounds like an unsafe rig to me. If the top bead moves under the weight of the lead the fish can move in any direction bar straight towards you and will be pulling line the whole time.
Indication with a properly set up heli should be miles better than with a lead clip set up
It sounds like an unsafe rig to me. If the top bead moves under the weight of the lead the fish can move in any direction bar straight towards you and will be pulling line the whole time.
Indication with a properly set up heli should be miles better than with a lead clip set up
Lead clip and tubing is my go to setup. Last week I changed over to heli's as my syndicate lake has got very weedy.
Like both, prefer lead clips.
Like both, prefer lead clips.