I hope I have this right. Darrell Peck described the necessity to overcast by two wraps on deep water to acount for the drag imparted on the mainline pulling the lead back considerably. I'm not sure about this at all and think he may be 'linhng' his baited area and fishing a single hookbait well off the baited patch. A squared + B squared equals C squared finds the longest side of a triangle (hypotenuse).which represents the line, where A is the distance from your feet to the slash and B is the depth. Unless it goes down on tight line, im going to stick to this formula.
In reply to Post #1
You've got your pythagoras theorem correct. But A is from where the line cuts through the water, which is moving back towards you as the lead sinks. And even then the line will probably be going down in an arc rather than a straight line. How far you would need to overcast would depend primarily on the depth, and to a lesser extent the distance you are casting.
You've got your pythagoras theorem correct. But A is from where the line cuts through the water, which is moving back towards you as the lead sinks. And even then the line will probably be going down in an arc rather than a straight line. How far you would need to overcast would depend primarily on the depth, and to a lesser extent the distance you are casting.
In reply to Post #2
You also need to take into account how much above the water your rod tip is....
I looked into this a few years ago in detail and unless your fishing a very deep lake at short range the distance is negligible......
Also at say 80 yards how accurate do you think your casting is, your now hitting a bin lid at those sort of ranges.
You also need to take into account how much above the water your rod tip is....
I looked into this a few years ago in detail and unless your fishing a very deep lake at short range the distance is negligible......
Also at say 80 yards how accurate do you think your casting is, your now hitting a bin lid at those sort of ranges.
In reply to Post #3
Both excellent replies. Thank you. Over 40yds and 7m it's half a wrap. As my Grandad would say ' neither sh☆t nor wattercress'. It's negligible.
Both excellent replies. Thank you. Over 40yds and 7m it's half a wrap. As my Grandad would say ' neither sh☆t nor wattercress'. It's negligible.
A play with this can give you a decent idea:
https://www.calculator.net/triangle-calculator.html
One side is the distance of cast.
Another side is the water depth + the height of tip ring above the surface.
The angle between the two is 90deg
That's all you need (Remember to use the same unit for both measurements)
Variables like line stretch, bow and whether the lead 'swings' or drops straight down mean that millimetre accuracy is too much to expect.
TLDR - unless it's very deep or very short range you don't need to overcast much; at 30m range and 3m depth it's about a 2ft overcast to swing down to the spot. At 60m range it's about 1ft. Guessing Darryl P must be fishing under the rod tip in an abyss.
https://www.calculator.net/triangle-calculator.html
One side is the distance of cast.
Another side is the water depth + the height of tip ring above the surface.
The angle between the two is 90deg
That's all you need (Remember to use the same unit for both measurements)
Variables like line stretch, bow and whether the lead 'swings' or drops straight down mean that millimetre accuracy is too much to expect.
TLDR - unless it's very deep or very short range you don't need to overcast much; at 30m range and 3m depth it's about a 2ft overcast to swing down to the spot. At 60m range it's about 1ft. Guessing Darryl P must be fishing under the rod tip in an abyss.
In reply to Post #1
Is it that time of year when people have run out of things to talk about, just before using bright singles on choddies comes back around?
Is it that time of year when people have run out of things to talk about, just before using bright singles on choddies comes back around?
In reply to Post #1
I think there are too many variables to calculate it so if I ever want to fish tight I will use a marker.
The hypotenuse doesn't work because one side of your triangle (the line) isn't straight when the lead hits the deck.
I think there are too many variables to calculate it so if I ever want to fish tight I will use a marker.
The hypotenuse doesn't work because one side of your triangle (the line) isn't straight when the lead hits the deck.
Watch the Rob Hughes underwater answers videos that will give you a far better idea than mathematical equations, which won't work in this scenario, due to too many variables
I'm sure DNA baits did an underwater video about this (might of just been Mozza and Rob Hughes and not DNA related) I think the outcome was that there was no real need to add anything on to account for the depth
Edit: it was Fox not DNA. If you go on YouTube and search for Underwater Answers with Rob Hughes you should find it
Edit: it was Fox not DNA. If you go on YouTube and search for Underwater Answers with Rob Hughes you should find it
In reply to Post #10
Already Linked by Tinhead .
Already Linked by Tinhead .
In reply to Post #5
Can we stick with yards 🙂,my sticks are in yards and I'm getting confused, I thought that was the easiest way.Do we all need to adjust our wrap sticks 🤔.
and metres,my marker rod is set up in feet, we don't need to change that do we?
Can we stick with yards 🙂,my sticks are in yards and I'm getting confused, I thought that was the easiest way.Do we all need to adjust our wrap sticks 🤔.
and metres,my marker rod is set up in feet, we don't need to change that do we?
In reply to Post #7
Thanks for the feedback 🙂
Thanks for the feedback 🙂
In reply to Post #1
So many variables on this subject.
If it really worries me, I normally PVA mesh a bright pop, or 2, up to the hook bait, and if conditions are reasonable, and not blowing a hooligan.
I cast out and watch the area close to the marker float, to see them hit the surface to see if it is close enough, or miles off, before baiting up.
So many variables on this subject.
If it really worries me, I normally PVA mesh a bright pop, or 2, up to the hook bait, and if conditions are reasonable, and not blowing a hooligan.
I cast out and watch the area close to the marker float, to see them hit the surface to see if it is close enough, or miles off, before baiting up.
I think using mathematical equations for this is pointless as already mentioned to many variables, the bit i saw was he was fishing in 37ft of water and casting his spod 1 rap shorter probably isnt far off the mark. Which is approx 1/3 of water depth.
The spod is going straight across the the water surface and the fishing rod if line is still in clip as lead hits down then it will need to be longer, the line wont be in a straight line from rod tip to lead there will be some degree of bow in the line as it goes through water column which renders mathematical equations inaccurate.
I would cast the fishing rod out with marker attached let it sink while in the clip then let marker pop up, cast spod out and set so it lands at same distance as marker then measure, it will be shorter than fishing rod in that depth of water.
The spod is going straight across the the water surface and the fishing rod if line is still in clip as lead hits down then it will need to be longer, the line wont be in a straight line from rod tip to lead there will be some degree of bow in the line as it goes through water column which renders mathematical equations inaccurate.
I would cast the fishing rod out with marker attached let it sink while in the clip then let marker pop up, cast spod out and set so it lands at same distance as marker then measure, it will be shorter than fishing rod in that depth of water.
In reply to Post #15
I've never fished anywhere near 37ft depth of water and as been said, too many variables to use maths.
In general most places I fish are 12ft deep or less and as I posted before you can't go wrong with the Fox video which more or less says clip your spod and baited rod at the same distance
another link to the Fox video
I've never fished anywhere near 37ft depth of water and as been said, too many variables to use maths.
In general most places I fish are 12ft deep or less and as I posted before you can't go wrong with the Fox video which more or less says clip your spod and baited rod at the same distance
another link to the Fox video
In reply to Post #16
In general on shallowish water the fox video and your link isnt far off the mark and any variant will be negligible.
I did a lot of testing 15-20 years ago when out in france on public lakes one of us out in a boat and another casting from the bank and like the fox video at normal depths it is very accurate clipped the same but the lead does come back in comparison to the spod the deeper the water gets
In general on shallowish water the fox video and your link isnt far off the mark and any variant will be negligible.
I did a lot of testing 15-20 years ago when out in france on public lakes one of us out in a boat and another casting from the bank and like the fox video at normal depths it is very accurate clipped the same but the lead does come back in comparison to the spod the deeper the water gets
This is taken from the written article of Rob Hughes and Mozza Underwater Answers,
It shows how much the distance reduces the swing back
It shows how much the distance reduces the swing back
Never understand why people have so much difficulty with this. Just set up a marker float on your other rod and work it out yourself. Cast, feel it down, then see where the float pops up. Everybody casts differently, different lines behave differently. Cut all the cr@p, and just see for yourself.
In reply to Post #19
I think some people overly worry.
I used to fish with someone who had a theory for everything, he was always telling me I was doing things wrong, pressurising me to do things his way, coming out with all these theories and when he changed his mind (which was often) it would be a due to a theory on his theory.
He was a great laugh though and I have some great memories but my catch rate improved when we drifted apart.
I think what I'm saying is fish can swim and if your bait is not spot on where you want it then that doesn't mean you won't catch.
I think some people overly worry.
I used to fish with someone who had a theory for everything, he was always telling me I was doing things wrong, pressurising me to do things his way, coming out with all these theories and when he changed his mind (which was often) it would be a due to a theory on his theory.
He was a great laugh though and I have some great memories but my catch rate improved when we drifted apart.
I think what I'm saying is fish can swim and if your bait is not spot on where you want it then that doesn't mean you won't catch.
In reply to Post #18
So basically if you're fishing at 10ft or under at 100 yards or under just cast at the marker float.
So basically if you're fishing at 10ft or under at 100 yards or under just cast at the marker float.
In reply to Post #19
Yes exactly too many variables to work the same for everyone
Yes exactly too many variables to work the same for everyone
In reply to Post #22
How you control the rod after the initial cast makes a big difference -ie travel with it or hit clip hard can see it bounce back a good way, worse at short range on clip with braid.
How you control the rod after the initial cast makes a big difference -ie travel with it or hit clip hard can see it bounce back a good way, worse at short range on clip with braid.
Just use a boat 
In reply to Post #24
You say that but I'm sure there was a thread on here about making allowances for how the freebies drop in relation to a baited hook when using a boat.
When are people going to accept that nothing is perfect and by trying to seek perfection they could be making matters worse?
You say that but I'm sure there was a thread on here about making allowances for how the freebies drop in relation to a baited hook when using a boat.
When are people going to accept that nothing is perfect and by trying to seek perfection they could be making matters worse?
Reading ALL pages