Anyone bought one yet, if so whats the quality like, as good as old stuff or not so? Cheers.
I'd be interested in this too.
Just a suggestion Goose, you thought about something along the lines of the Fox Frontier just for maximum air flow in the summer months? I love my Pioneer, just could do with more ventage action.
Just curious, why the 150? I've the 100 2019 model which I get all my kit in plus two large dogs and still have quite a bit of room if I put everything under the bedchair and behind it.
Just a suggestion Goose, you thought about something along the lines of the Fox Frontier just for maximum air flow in the summer months? I love my Pioneer, just could do with more ventage action.
Just curious, why the 150? I've the 100 2019 model which I get all my kit in plus two large dogs and still have quite a bit of room if I put everything under the bedchair and behind it.
In reply to Post #2
Im interested are you under 5ft 4 inches tall then ?
Im interested are you under 5ft 4 inches tall then ?
In reply to Post #3
Nah.
Have walking into the peak more than a few times shouting 'f**ks sakes' 🤡
Nah.
Have walking into the peak more than a few times shouting 'f**ks sakes' 🤡
In reply to Post #4
Think aqua have started advertising a pioneer ultralite
In reply to Post #6
Yeah for £749.99 going pre-order 3
Yeah for £749.99 going pre-order 3
In reply to Post #7
The original ultralite was the perfect size for me.
The original ultralite was the perfect size for me.
In reply to Post #8
Might be worth a look at for you
Might be worth a look at for you
In reply to Post #9
Video says same size as 100 model.
Video says same size as 100 model.
In reply to Post #10
Looks like more headroom from the video
Looks like more headroom from the video
In reply to Post #11
Are the pioneers not free standing, as in needing storm poles to hold them up?what the advantage over a tempest or frontier?
Are the pioneers not free standing, as in needing storm poles to hold them up?what the advantage over a tempest or frontier?
In reply to Post #12
Despite what makers may claim a flat back is not good in high winds, original titan and later pioneer were the best bivvies in gale force winds.
Despite what makers may claim a flat back is not good in high winds, original titan and later pioneer were the best bivvies in gale force winds.
That new ultralight looks very good, practically half the weight of my normal 100, plus bigger vents at the back and taller. August eh...hmmm.
In reply to Post #14
Looks very nice,did the original have any issues with the poles
Looks very nice,did the original have any issues with the poles
In reply to Post #15
I had the Original Pioneer was a superb shelter
then the Ultralite came out and a few people I know bought one the poles were too thin and often snapped they regularly cracked where they went into the hub in comparison to the original they were Ultracrap IMHO
I had the Original Pioneer was a superb shelter
then the Ultralite came out and a few people I know bought one the poles were too thin and often snapped they regularly cracked where they went into the hub in comparison to the original they were Ultracrap IMHO
In reply to Post #16
Looking at the video the poles do look thin and could be a weak point
Looking at the video the poles do look thin and could be a weak point
In reply to Post #17
750 quid. For a plastic block and thinner poles. Couldn't make it up imo.
750 quid. For a plastic block and thinner poles. Couldn't make it up imo.
In reply to Post #18
Anti fatigue block,revolutionary poles.They will be tried and tested for the last 2 years obviously
Anti fatigue block,revolutionary poles.They will be tried and tested for the last 2 years obviously
In reply to Post #19
Of course
Of course
In reply to Post #17
Thing is I liked the weight of the original as it felt robust and good quality, not so sure about the latest offerings.
Thing is I liked the weight of the original as it felt robust and good quality, not so sure about the latest offerings.
In reply to Post #21
You would hope this would be better as technology and materials have advanced
You would hope this would be better as technology and materials have advanced
In reply to Post #22
But realistically quality has nosedived since the original. It's a different company now. Same old sh*t at hyper inflated prices imo.
But realistically quality has nosedived since the original. It's a different company now. Same old sh*t at hyper inflated prices imo.
In reply to Post #23
If only it were the same as old original quality.
If only it were the same as old original quality.
In reply to Post #23
I totally agree and won't be giving them my money for one
I totally agree and won't be giving them my money for one
In reply to Post #16
How long ago is that Gerry - The Original Pioneer? As I remember one of the very first half dozen ever made being dropped off/used by Roger Seaton on “The Wood” as he was doing a three day session with me.
It was much bigger than the later Ultralite, hence there was nowhere near as much stored stress at the block, and not prone to the M5 Cap Heads ripping out of the two Cups, S Clips Snapping, or the Poles bending/end falling out as the Ultralite was prone too.
How long ago is that Gerry - The Original Pioneer? As I remember one of the very first half dozen ever made being dropped off/used by Roger Seaton on “The Wood” as he was doing a three day session with me.
It was much bigger than the later Ultralite, hence there was nowhere near as much stored stress at the block, and not prone to the M5 Cap Heads ripping out of the two Cups, S Clips Snapping, or the Poles bending/end falling out as the Ultralite was prone too.
In reply to Post #26
2004 the original pioneer came out.......
2004 the original pioneer came out.......
In reply to Post #27
Wow that long ago!
I was in awe at the sheer size of it sat next to my JRC brolly system, both in the bay swim
Wow that long ago!
I was in awe at the sheer size of it sat next to my JRC brolly system, both in the bay swim
In reply to Post #28
First production one was given to Pete Springate, remember him using it for the first time and asking about it.
First production one was given to Pete Springate, remember him using it for the first time and asking about it.
In reply to Post #23
I couldn't agree more yonny up goes the price again because it's new out don't make it any good a lot of people will buy one but not me
I couldn't agree more yonny up goes the price again because it's new out don't make it any good a lot of people will buy one but not me
In reply to Post #26
lost my hard drive with lots of pics with dates but I think it was around 2007 and the tube thickness was a lot different to the Ultracrap its more of a 1.5 man shelter only pic I have is this one now sadly I did have the extended wrap for it that was great on week long sessions ( the grass and mat were left in the bushes so I used them lol )
lost my hard drive with lots of pics with dates but I think it was around 2007 and the tube thickness was a lot different to the Ultracrap its more of a 1.5 man shelter only pic I have is this one now sadly I did have the extended wrap for it that was great on week long sessions ( the grass and mat were left in the bushes so I used them lol )
In reply to Post #31
I remember the Ultralite was only designed because some customers were moaning about the sheer size of the Pioneer, and wanted something smaller.
I'll never forget the first time out with my Ultralite, was on “The Wood” again on my tod with just the dog – it was a pitch black autumn night had the door shut, fast asleep. Suddenly there was one hell of a load bang and I found myself inside a closed Bivvy! The bloody S Clip had snapped, so I put the two Poles in squeezed them together and wrapped Bungee straps off the barrow around them to make do.
I remember the Ultralite was only designed because some customers were moaning about the sheer size of the Pioneer, and wanted something smaller.
I'll never forget the first time out with my Ultralite, was on “The Wood” again on my tod with just the dog – it was a pitch black autumn night had the door shut, fast asleep. Suddenly there was one hell of a load bang and I found myself inside a closed Bivvy! The bloody S Clip had snapped, so I put the two Poles in squeezed them together and wrapped Bungee straps off the barrow around them to make do.
In reply to Post #32
In reply to Post #32
Bloody hell I had hear rumours that some people had the S clip snapping but looking at mine I thought it was impossible
the only trouble I had was the erection handles bent (the spigot bit) they then changed them to a stronger set
Bloody hell I had hear rumours that some people had the S clip snapping but looking at mine I thought it was impossible
the only trouble I had was the erection handles bent (the spigot bit) they then changed them to a stronger set
750 for a 2021 bivvy and no option to open/close the windows from the inside, with the wrap over it you always have to pull up the wrap if you want to open/close the windows..
Another point why I passed on the Pioneer 150, transport length 1750 + you have more space inside with my smaller Frontier XD + more height
Another point why I passed on the Pioneer 150, transport length 1750 + you have more space inside with my smaller Frontier XD + more height
In reply to Post #34
There was one hell of a lot of stored stress once that S Clip was fitted Gerry, I used to make loads of S Clips out of 8mm stainless (Originals were 6mm) and the Cups out of Stainless instead of Ally with M6 shallow head stainless locking screws, with added Nylock Nuts inside the Cups for extra reliability, and the 2 x Poles out of 12mm solid Stainless
The irony was I had built up my own Ultralite myself in the factory that day. It was a case of “If you want to take an Ultralite now you will have to build it up yourself, we are all busy getting this batch ready for delivery in the morning” It was pure luck that I went on the Wood that night as Aqua would have been in serious poo otherwise.
In the morning dew I noticed rust stains below everyone of the Pole ends, I instantly knew what had happened, phoned Neil urgently (The manager) “Did someone go and get some washers for the Pole ends?” reply was “yes” I told him to stop the delivery at all cost, as someone had picked up Bright Steel washers not Stainless!!!!
There was one hell of a lot of stored stress once that S Clip was fitted Gerry, I used to make loads of S Clips out of 8mm stainless (Originals were 6mm) and the Cups out of Stainless instead of Ally with M6 shallow head stainless locking screws, with added Nylock Nuts inside the Cups for extra reliability, and the 2 x Poles out of 12mm solid Stainless
The irony was I had built up my own Ultralite myself in the factory that day. It was a case of “If you want to take an Ultralite now you will have to build it up yourself, we are all busy getting this batch ready for delivery in the morning” It was pure luck that I went on the Wood that night as Aqua would have been in serious poo otherwise.
In the morning dew I noticed rust stains below everyone of the Pole ends, I instantly knew what had happened, phoned Neil urgently (The manager) “Did someone go and get some washers for the Pole ends?” reply was “yes” I told him to stop the delivery at all cost, as someone had picked up Bright Steel washers not Stainless!!!!
In reply to Post #31
Brilliant bivvy. Still got mine. I mostly do overnighters either
Alone in the tempest brolly or with my kid in the Cayman
But if its any longer or expecting bad weather I still get the original Pioneer out.
Brilliant bivvy. Still got mine. I mostly do overnighters either
Alone in the tempest brolly or with my kid in the Cayman
But if its any longer or expecting bad weather I still get the original Pioneer out.
In reply to Post #36
Strange that my ultralite I kept and used as my only bivvy for over ten years without one problem. It was a pre release show model that was not supposed to be sold but what's his face from aqua was rat arsed and let have it.
Strange that my ultralite I kept and used as my only bivvy for over ten years without one problem. It was a pre release show model that was not supposed to be sold but what's his face from aqua was rat arsed and let have it.
In reply to Post #16
. . .dunno why you have such issues with the Ultralite Gerry . . .I've had the Trakker one since release (2009/10?) and it remains arguably the best all round shelter I've ever owned. There may have been some duff ones but I've never had an issue with either the block, the block fixings or any of the arms . . .the skull cap has NEVER been removed, the bivvy fabric hasn't faded and the seams and stitching are all immaculate . . .
The secret IMHO is not being hamfisted with it upon erection (ooeerr) . . .I'm anal about ensuring all the ribs are totally separated with no folds / overlaps etc. Goes up like a dream in seconds . . .few pegs and some quick connectors on the storm poles job done . . .
Also have a Pio 150 . . .love it for all the same reasons plus better space / rear airvents) but is way more of a beast to lug and takes up 50% of the barrow . . .weirdly headroom between the 150 and Ultralite is very similar . . which is why I never bought the Pio 100 as its designed for hobbits . . .
. . .dunno why you have such issues with the Ultralite Gerry . . .I've had the Trakker one since release (2009/10?) and it remains arguably the best all round shelter I've ever owned. There may have been some duff ones but I've never had an issue with either the block, the block fixings or any of the arms . . .the skull cap has NEVER been removed, the bivvy fabric hasn't faded and the seams and stitching are all immaculate . . .
The secret IMHO is not being hamfisted with it upon erection (ooeerr) . . .I'm anal about ensuring all the ribs are totally separated with no folds / overlaps etc. Goes up like a dream in seconds . . .few pegs and some quick connectors on the storm poles job done . . .
Also have a Pio 150 . . .love it for all the same reasons plus better space / rear airvents) but is way more of a beast to lug and takes up 50% of the barrow . . .weirdly headroom between the 150 and Ultralite is very similar . . which is why I never bought the Pio 100 as its designed for hobbits . . .
In reply to Post #39
probably because I had the more heavy duty original full size Pio and never had any problems at all
and heard far to many of the thin walled ultralite poles snapping and seen the drips and leaks of the velcro front when I mentioned to a pal that I had heard the poles cracked where they entered the block
he decided to check and bingo 3 were cracked luckily it was under a year old and got them replaced
I completely AGREE a lot of poles snapped thru people not fanning it out ....but I am of the opinion they would not have snapped had the tubes been a thicker wall
probably because I had the more heavy duty original full size Pio and never had any problems at all
and heard far to many of the thin walled ultralite poles snapping and seen the drips and leaks of the velcro front when I mentioned to a pal that I had heard the poles cracked where they entered the block
he decided to check and bingo 3 were cracked luckily it was under a year old and got them replaced
I completely AGREE a lot of poles snapped thru people not fanning it out ....but I am of the opinion they would not have snapped had the tubes been a thicker wall
In reply to Post #39
Hi Chris, what's the build quality like on your 150, do you see it lasting as long as your ultra?
Hi Chris, what's the build quality like on your 150, do you see it lasting as long as your ultra?
In reply to Post #40
All they had to do was make the pockets the Poles fitted into out of a stretchy material like modern Bivvys are, and all the problems would have ceased instantly – it would have compensated for the Bivvy Skin being different sizes.
They were handmade, all the panels were cut by hand on a large table to templates, variation can't be prevented.
But was the more elastic material that's full of holes available back then?
All they had to do was make the pockets the Poles fitted into out of a stretchy material like modern Bivvys are, and all the problems would have ceased instantly – it would have compensated for the Bivvy Skin being different sizes.
They were handmade, all the panels were cut by hand on a large table to templates, variation can't be prevented.
But was the more elastic material that's full of holes available back then?
In reply to Post #41
Hi Glen . . .build quality on the Pio 150 is good - block and arms are all solid, fabric is v thick (I have the pre- EV variant) and even the mozzie mesh is a heavier weight fabric . . .the groundsheet is heavyweight and it comes with a clear door for winter should you wish to swap out the mozzie mesh under the solid door . . .I leave the rear vents on the bivvy permanently open and only close the vents on the skull cap which I also leave on permanently . . .only things I don't like about it are -
1 - The pegging points / skull cap leash points are plastic, not metal. Can see these perishing / breaking over time
2 - Quicksticks are lightweight but a bit flimsy - the quickstick connection is not as quick as an aftermarket prologic type connector. I like to tension the bivvy drum tight (with the storm poles) but can see these poss breaking over time. This would mean replacement would be difficult as the storm caps are quickstick compatible only
3 - Don't really like the 'peak' as it doesn't really work that well anyway (is not pronounced enough to stop rain coming through the door) and also means locating additional weight 'mini' arms at the front of the bivvy every time you set up which is just another thing to do . . .not the end of the world but just a little superfluous . . .
I only got it because the ONLY bad thing about the Ultralite is the footprint in-conjunction with todays bedchairs . . .I bought a new 'Standard' sized Tactical X and its mahoosive compared to my previous standard bed, which in turn reduces the space at the front of the bivvy . . .
If you regularly do min 48hr sessions and get depressed and damp sitting in small shelters during a downpour, you want a permanently twin skinned shelter but don't want to be another tempest clone and don't mind lugging a heavy and long bit of kit around, the 150 is fantastic!
Hi Glen . . .build quality on the Pio 150 is good - block and arms are all solid, fabric is v thick (I have the pre- EV variant) and even the mozzie mesh is a heavier weight fabric . . .the groundsheet is heavyweight and it comes with a clear door for winter should you wish to swap out the mozzie mesh under the solid door . . .I leave the rear vents on the bivvy permanently open and only close the vents on the skull cap which I also leave on permanently . . .only things I don't like about it are -
1 - The pegging points / skull cap leash points are plastic, not metal. Can see these perishing / breaking over time
2 - Quicksticks are lightweight but a bit flimsy - the quickstick connection is not as quick as an aftermarket prologic type connector. I like to tension the bivvy drum tight (with the storm poles) but can see these poss breaking over time. This would mean replacement would be difficult as the storm caps are quickstick compatible only
3 - Don't really like the 'peak' as it doesn't really work that well anyway (is not pronounced enough to stop rain coming through the door) and also means locating additional weight 'mini' arms at the front of the bivvy every time you set up which is just another thing to do . . .not the end of the world but just a little superfluous . . .
I only got it because the ONLY bad thing about the Ultralite is the footprint in-conjunction with todays bedchairs . . .I bought a new 'Standard' sized Tactical X and its mahoosive compared to my previous standard bed, which in turn reduces the space at the front of the bivvy . . .
If you regularly do min 48hr sessions and get depressed and damp sitting in small shelters during a downpour, you want a permanently twin skinned shelter but don't want to be another tempest clone and don't mind lugging a heavy and long bit of kit around, the 150 is fantastic!
In reply to Post #43
Cheers Chris, it would purely be a session bivvy or for when storms were forecast.
Cheers Chris, it would purely be a session bivvy or for when storms were forecast.
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