Evening chaps.
Looking at the individual milk proteins available and realising that the selection for each type is vast.
Which got me thinking for the percentage of milks required in a bait it would be possible to use 2/3 different types of say (whey) to get to that ratio, which obviously have different attributes solubility, protein, Aa's etc.
But what would be people's train of thought of combining the different types say whey/casein when you could just use one which would have a similar taste profile.
And why would you choose one over the other?
Whey or casein for instance?
Thanks Tom.
Looking at the individual milk proteins available and realising that the selection for each type is vast.
Which got me thinking for the percentage of milks required in a bait it would be possible to use 2/3 different types of say (whey) to get to that ratio, which obviously have different attributes solubility, protein, Aa's etc.
But what would be people's train of thought of combining the different types say whey/casein when you could just use one which would have a similar taste profile.
And why would you choose one over the other?
Whey or casein for instance?
Thanks Tom.
In reply to Post #1
You might want to add different milks to aid gelling/setting of the bait or different meshes to adjust the coarseness of the mix.
You might want to add different milks to aid gelling/setting of the bait or different meshes to adjust the coarseness of the mix.
In reply to Post #2
Thank you Blankasorus, I understand utilising different forms of casein for example because they offer different things but I'm more interested in the thinking behind combining two different, because there seems to be all variants within casein or whey range.
And if you were to select one over the other, what would be the reasoning?
Thank you Blankasorus, I understand utilising different forms of casein for example because they offer different things but I'm more interested in the thinking behind combining two different, because there seems to be all variants within casein or whey range.
And if you were to select one over the other, what would be the reasoning?
In reply to Post #3
I think you may get a load of different answers on this one, Tom!
Personally if I had to choose one, I'd go for WPC80, as it covers lots of boxes in terms of binding, partial solubility, protein content, and one that casein is lacking a little in-taste (albeit to a human palate).
There's an excellent discussion on milks in Sam Barleys podcast with Dean (aka Saggybelly) of Scientific Baits. Well worth listening to, one of the best recorded bait discussions I've ever heard (tho I massively disagree with Dean over enzymes, but that's nothing to do with milks).
I think you may get a load of different answers on this one, Tom!
Personally if I had to choose one, I'd go for WPC80, as it covers lots of boxes in terms of binding, partial solubility, protein content, and one that casein is lacking a little in-taste (albeit to a human palate).
There's an excellent discussion on milks in Sam Barleys podcast with Dean (aka Saggybelly) of Scientific Baits. Well worth listening to, one of the best recorded bait discussions I've ever heard (tho I massively disagree with Dean over enzymes, but that's nothing to do with milks).
In reply to Post #4
Thanks Nemesis.
😂
Thought I might get a few different answers.
I only listened to that podcast yesterday 😁.
Am I right in thinking the selection of different milks in each category (whey for example) was limited when a lot of the original recipes were conceived, so a combination of milks was chosen.
But it would actually be better to use one or the other, from a complimentary perspective, which is now possible.
Thanks Nemesis.
😂
Thought I might get a few different answers.
I only listened to that podcast yesterday 😁.
Am I right in thinking the selection of different milks in each category (whey for example) was limited when a lot of the original recipes were conceived, so a combination of milks was chosen.
But it would actually be better to use one or the other, from a complimentary perspective, which is now possible.
In reply to Post #4
Can you tell me how I listen to this podcast please. Would I be able to listen on an iPhone.?
Can you tell me how I listen to this podcast please. Would I be able to listen on an iPhone.?
In reply to Post #6
The Carp Angler Chronicles, Wayne. I think you should be able to get it from their site if you Google it.
The Carp Angler Chronicles, Wayne. I think you should be able to get it from their site if you Google it.
In reply to Post #7
You are a gentleman. Thank you.
You are a gentleman. Thank you.
In reply to Post #4
Going off topic now but do you believe Sam is right thinking there is some interesting side effects to enzyme activity?
Going off topic now but do you believe Sam is right thinking there is some interesting side effects to enzyme activity?
In reply to Post #9
I found that part interesting too, the only comparison I could draw would be when you have particles at there various stages of fermentation and at a certain time they are just right.
Well that's how I found it easiest to interpret the concept.
I found that part interesting too, the only comparison I could draw would be when you have particles at there various stages of fermentation and at a certain time they are just right.
Well that's how I found it easiest to interpret the concept.
In reply to Post #9
Good question. I certainly don't think the enzymes are attractive in themselves, but i do wonder that during the hydrolysis process, that purely by the physical degradation of the likes on milks, fishmeals, spices etc, that maybe organic acids, oils are released. Pure speculation though.
Good question. I certainly don't think the enzymes are attractive in themselves, but i do wonder that during the hydrolysis process, that purely by the physical degradation of the likes on milks, fishmeals, spices etc, that maybe organic acids, oils are released. Pure speculation though.
In reply to Post #11
I agree, but have no facts to back it up.
When you use the protein binding enzyme transglutaminase I believe ammonia is released but not sure what happens with other enzymes.
I agree, but have no facts to back it up.
When you use the protein binding enzyme transglutaminase I believe ammonia is released but not sure what happens with other enzymes.
In reply to Post #12
Proteins will turn into amino acids, I would say extremely good free form
Starches into sugars
Proteins will turn into amino acids, I would say extremely good free form
Starches into sugars
In reply to Post #13
Absolutely very beneficial, but that would be possible to achieve by just putting the hydrolysate into a bait, or adding sugars and free AAs.
The discussion in question was if there was other substances being released in the process that might be interesting thus making it a point putting the actual enzyme(s) into the bait.
Absolutely very beneficial, but that would be possible to achieve by just putting the hydrolysate into a bait, or adding sugars and free AAs.
The discussion in question was if there was other substances being released in the process that might be interesting thus making it a point putting the actual enzyme(s) into the bait.
In reply to Post #14
Enzymes are utilised in the carp's metabolic/ physiological (after oral intake of bait) processes and within baits.
The former are complicated processes and in terms of fishing, interest in enzyme action is largely restricted to bait
We also need to keep in mind the definition of an enzyme, it regulates/ initiates chemical reactions without chemical changes to itself under set parameters of principally specificity, temperature and concentration.
So in basic terms the chemicals produced from a reaction initiated/regulated by enzymes will be known, there will be no “hidden” chemicals although there may be a change in physical properties such as solubility, viscosity etc .
Enzymes are utilised in the carp's metabolic/ physiological (after oral intake of bait) processes and within baits.
The former are complicated processes and in terms of fishing, interest in enzyme action is largely restricted to bait
We also need to keep in mind the definition of an enzyme, it regulates/ initiates chemical reactions without chemical changes to itself under set parameters of principally specificity, temperature and concentration.
So in basic terms the chemicals produced from a reaction initiated/regulated by enzymes will be known, there will be no “hidden” chemicals although there may be a change in physical properties such as solubility, viscosity etc .