In reply to Post #28
Yes it did, and I wish the original recipe was still available. Loved that bait!
Yes it did, and I wish the original recipe was still available. Loved that bait!
Does it really matter?
The difference between frozen and shelfies/stabilized baits from the likes of Baitworks is so small these days.
The difference between frozen and shelfies/stabilized baits from the likes of Baitworks is so small these days.
In reply to Post #32
Does it really matter? ...I guess that is the reason why I posted the question in the first place. As it stands it does matter on the grounds of cost. I never want to run out of bait... so generally I take more than I need and some gets wasted as I don't refreeze it.
If I used shelf life the bait remaining would not be wasted. I would perhaps bring back unopened bags etc.
There is talk of shelf life baits being banned on some waters due to a perception that they don't break down on the lake bed as quickly as fresh/frozen baits do... that would open up another discussion.
Does it really matter? ...I guess that is the reason why I posted the question in the first place. As it stands it does matter on the grounds of cost. I never want to run out of bait... so generally I take more than I need and some gets wasted as I don't refreeze it.
If I used shelf life the bait remaining would not be wasted. I would perhaps bring back unopened bags etc.
There is talk of shelf life baits being banned on some waters due to a perception that they don't break down on the lake bed as quickly as fresh/frozen baits do... that would open up another discussion.
In reply to Post #33
Seen that , no shelfies, there are some baits that would sit there till the cows come home,
Seen that , no shelfies, there are some baits that would sit there till the cows come home,
In reply to Post #33
Put them in a bucket, bit of glug no one is the wiser
Put them in a bucket, bit of glug no one is the wiser
In reply to Post #35
What will it take to change the masses from shelf life to freezer baits? A good friend of mine who sells bait tells me shelf life is the majority of their sales now. Whereas our baits are currently the other way round? We sell more fresh (maybe cos we push it more I don't know). Oh how times have changed
What will it take to change the masses from shelf life to freezer baits? A good friend of mine who sells bait tells me shelf life is the majority of their sales now. Whereas our baits are currently the other way round? We sell more fresh (maybe cos we push it more I don't know). Oh how times have changed
I occasionally purchase shelf life boilies to keep in the car in case I run out of my bait, when I do so I know what I have purchased.
Generally I make my own bait or have my own recipe made for me, it's absolutely important to me that these are freezer baits that will start to degrade almost as soon as they are out of the freezer, that breakdown is part of the attraction that I have planned in my bait and is so much more effective than any glug.
To me it makes perfect sense for a manufacturer to want to only make one version of a bait and that a shelf life version that is so much easier store and transport. But I do find it underhand and underlies why I cannot bring myself to consider buying freezer bait from the big manufacturers... If ever I find myself needing to buy a freezer bait it will be from a small producer who puts together there own ingredients into a basemix and rolls them in house.
Generally I make my own bait or have my own recipe made for me, it's absolutely important to me that these are freezer baits that will start to degrade almost as soon as they are out of the freezer, that breakdown is part of the attraction that I have planned in my bait and is so much more effective than any glug.
To me it makes perfect sense for a manufacturer to want to only make one version of a bait and that a shelf life version that is so much easier store and transport. But I do find it underhand and underlies why I cannot bring myself to consider buying freezer bait from the big manufacturers... If ever I find myself needing to buy a freezer bait it will be from a small producer who puts together there own ingredients into a basemix and rolls them in house.
In reply to Post #35
Hand on heart, I've never bought a shelf life bait. I rarely fish more than an overnighter and have a freezer so why would I?
Hand on heart, I've never bought a shelf life bait. I rarely fish more than an overnighter and have a freezer so why would I?
In reply to Post #38
I normally refer to Shelfies as dead baits as there's virtually nothing going on in them!
I normally refer to Shelfies as dead baits as there's virtually nothing going on in them!
In reply to Post #33
Only last week when at a work party post spawning did I see and smell the remains of a load of shelf life hung up in weed which was getting raked from the lake. Now bare in the mind the lake has been closed for 4 weeks, that puts the bait at a month old already and was still hard as marble as smelt like baby vomit.
The above has now started the discussion about a shelf life ban on the lake in question which I'm all for after witnessing first hand what happens when it goes uneaten.
I can't even remember the last time I purchased shelf life myself. At the moment I'm fishing with a boilie which breaks downs after 12-16 hours and seeing a massive increase in catch rate over the last few months since I started using it.
Only last week when at a work party post spawning did I see and smell the remains of a load of shelf life hung up in weed which was getting raked from the lake. Now bare in the mind the lake has been closed for 4 weeks, that puts the bait at a month old already and was still hard as marble as smelt like baby vomit.
The above has now started the discussion about a shelf life ban on the lake in question which I'm all for after witnessing first hand what happens when it goes uneaten.
I can't even remember the last time I purchased shelf life myself. At the moment I'm fishing with a boilie which breaks downs after 12-16 hours and seeing a massive increase in catch rate over the last few months since I started using it.
Im probably wrong, but from my failed attempt at bait making, and this is probably why it was failed, but all of the ingredients that went into the mix were shelf life. Powders, liquids, all came in little pots that stayed in the garage. The only fresh ingredient was egg. I doubt many mass produced freezer baits are much different. So why woild a freezer bait breakdown but a shelf life not?
Would a very heavily air dried freezer bait breakdown the same as a fresh freezer bait?
For the record i use a shelf life bait, one i believe is good quality, and it doesnt take long to break down at all, in my experience anyway.
Would a very heavily air dried freezer bait breakdown the same as a fresh freezer bait?
For the record i use a shelf life bait, one i believe is good quality, and it doesnt take long to break down at all, in my experience anyway.
In reply to Post #40
And there in lies the problem with some shelfies, the inconsistency in the preservative levels, some are obvious poor, with a waxy like texture that would take an age to break down.
I have no problem in using a shelf life bait from certain manufacturers. Take Baitworks for example, drop a shelfie in a tank alongside a freezer bait and the breakdown times are not far apart...........now that could mean, (as suggested in the OP) that Baitworks are selling the same bait as both freezer and shelflife. The fact that my last order of freezer bait from them was dispatched on a Friday and arrived on the Monday in perfect condition could lend weight to that. Their defence when I questioned the freshness after being sat in a couriers warehouse for the weekend was that they vacuum seal their bait for freshness.....well only 2 of the 4 5KG bags were actually vacuum sealed.....
I would be surprised but you never know! Either way I have zero problem in using them.
And there in lies the problem with some shelfies, the inconsistency in the preservative levels, some are obvious poor, with a waxy like texture that would take an age to break down.
I have no problem in using a shelf life bait from certain manufacturers. Take Baitworks for example, drop a shelfie in a tank alongside a freezer bait and the breakdown times are not far apart...........now that could mean, (as suggested in the OP) that Baitworks are selling the same bait as both freezer and shelflife. The fact that my last order of freezer bait from them was dispatched on a Friday and arrived on the Monday in perfect condition could lend weight to that. Their defence when I questioned the freshness after being sat in a couriers warehouse for the weekend was that they vacuum seal their bait for freshness.....well only 2 of the 4 5KG bags were actually vacuum sealed.....
I would be surprised but you never know! Either way I have zero problem in using them.
In reply to Post #37
A number of manufacturers use exactly the same recipe for shelf lifes and frozen. It is down to the treatment after boiling and drying that differentiates them.
Frozen baits will be dried and frozen, bit obvious that, but basically just a 'surface dry'.
Shelf life baits may be totally air dried out to remove all water, (making them lighter) or after drying, then given a glycerol/sugar syrup bath before a dry and bagging up.
Frozen bait vs shelf life is a big question.
For years I liked the baits that after thawing on day 2/3 started to 'turn', got a white dusting, basically the sugars and enzymes coming to the surface of the bait, that is pre-mould, before they go mouldy.
Then I discovered that some shelf life baits were the same as the frozen, and could be more attractive instantly than frozen baits because of this glycerol syrup treatment, so I started fishing both together. The shelfie version on the hair, because they stayed hard longer, and baiting up with both together.
Solars Seafood Takeaway was one such bait, I caught on both versions.
Then for some reason I switched to Rod Hutchinson KMG, shelf life, and caught. I have not changed bait since. I caught from Nazeing South and Central and Alton Water, giving me the confidence to carry on using the bait in shelf life version.
A number of manufacturers use exactly the same recipe for shelf lifes and frozen. It is down to the treatment after boiling and drying that differentiates them.
Frozen baits will be dried and frozen, bit obvious that, but basically just a 'surface dry'.
Shelf life baits may be totally air dried out to remove all water, (making them lighter) or after drying, then given a glycerol/sugar syrup bath before a dry and bagging up.
Frozen bait vs shelf life is a big question.
For years I liked the baits that after thawing on day 2/3 started to 'turn', got a white dusting, basically the sugars and enzymes coming to the surface of the bait, that is pre-mould, before they go mouldy.
Then I discovered that some shelf life baits were the same as the frozen, and could be more attractive instantly than frozen baits because of this glycerol syrup treatment, so I started fishing both together. The shelfie version on the hair, because they stayed hard longer, and baiting up with both together.
Solars Seafood Takeaway was one such bait, I caught on both versions.
Then for some reason I switched to Rod Hutchinson KMG, shelf life, and caught. I have not changed bait since. I caught from Nazeing South and Central and Alton Water, giving me the confidence to carry on using the bait in shelf life version.
In reply to Post #18
If you have incorporated high levels of Vecon, Belachan and or other salts and sugars then those baits as I am well versed in will last from 3 weeks to one month without ANY added chemicals preservatives. Not forgetting that fish meals and almost any other ingredient will have their own preservatives during manufacture . Citric acid seems to be in many products.
If you have incorporated high levels of Vecon, Belachan and or other salts and sugars then those baits as I am well versed in will last from 3 weeks to one month without ANY added chemicals preservatives. Not forgetting that fish meals and almost any other ingredient will have their own preservatives during manufacture . Citric acid seems to be in many products.
In reply to Post #44
so they dont add any preservatives pre the boiling stage
so they dont add any preservatives pre the boiling stage