In reply to Post #14
Yes. That is my considered opinion on this though there are some who disagree.
Yes. That is my considered opinion on this though there are some who disagree.
In reply to Post #12
There are actually 2 points, both the line meeting the water and your rod tip.
After all that, I put my marker float out and aim to hit it, or just left or right of it.
Clipped up I know I will get swing back and the line is tight. If I don't clip up the lead will continue on the angle it hits the water as the water slows it down. Lead shape does make a difference. Distance and pear leads travelling further than grippers.
As for my spod and Spomb, again I aim for the marker float. Even in water as shallow as a foot, a Spomb load (or even bait boat load) of groundbait spreads. From impact point you can get a dinner plate sized spread of crumb. With sweetcorn or maize it can be side plate sized.
Now work this out with your particles in deeper water, undertow, bars, plateaus etc, you will be spreading your bait out across an area bigger than you think. Even tipping a bucket of bait by hand in in 4 feet of water you get current spread!
This is where balled groundbait full of particles, boilies etc may work in your favour. A wet sticky ball of groundbait in your Spomb will go down to the bottom with fewer particles drifting free.
If you are spodding or Spombing bait in, put in as much as you think you need, then do the same amount again.
There are actually 2 points, both the line meeting the water and your rod tip.
After all that, I put my marker float out and aim to hit it, or just left or right of it.
Clipped up I know I will get swing back and the line is tight. If I don't clip up the lead will continue on the angle it hits the water as the water slows it down. Lead shape does make a difference. Distance and pear leads travelling further than grippers.
As for my spod and Spomb, again I aim for the marker float. Even in water as shallow as a foot, a Spomb load (or even bait boat load) of groundbait spreads. From impact point you can get a dinner plate sized spread of crumb. With sweetcorn or maize it can be side plate sized.
Now work this out with your particles in deeper water, undertow, bars, plateaus etc, you will be spreading your bait out across an area bigger than you think. Even tipping a bucket of bait by hand in in 4 feet of water you get current spread!
This is where balled groundbait full of particles, boilies etc may work in your favour. A wet sticky ball of groundbait in your Spomb will go down to the bottom with fewer particles drifting free.
If you are spodding or Spombing bait in, put in as much as you think you need, then do the same amount again.
In reply to Post #14
Yes, without any variables if you hit the clip at the same number of wraps / distance at 100 yards, and in 18ft of water you will theoretically be fishing at 99.62 yards, or 99yards 2ft...
That's based on the rod being at 12 o'clock when you hit the clip and feel the lead down, based on a 6ft angler holding the rod as high as possible to give the maximum theoretical swing back and fishing 18ft deep...
In theory if your fishing at 50 yards it will be 6 inches out and at 75 yards 9 inches, if you want to be really technical you could add the length of your hook link as the above calculations are based on rod tip to lead weight....
If you were fishing a chod / helicopter set up with the top bead set at say 4ft from the lead you could argue that a further 4ft off line is added to the baited rod./ add the distance to the top bead.
Yes, without any variables if you hit the clip at the same number of wraps / distance at 100 yards, and in 18ft of water you will theoretically be fishing at 99.62 yards, or 99yards 2ft...
That's based on the rod being at 12 o'clock when you hit the clip and feel the lead down, based on a 6ft angler holding the rod as high as possible to give the maximum theoretical swing back and fishing 18ft deep...
In theory if your fishing at 50 yards it will be 6 inches out and at 75 yards 9 inches, if you want to be really technical you could add the length of your hook link as the above calculations are based on rod tip to lead weight....
If you were fishing a chod / helicopter set up with the top bead set at say 4ft from the lead you could argue that a further 4ft off line is added to the baited rod./ add the distance to the top bead.
In reply to Post #15
I have done the 1/4 rule in the past, but the more i thought about it the more it didn't make sense to me....
The problem with the variables is its an estimated guess to how much they are impacting your distance.
For a good example if you were fishing tight to an island with no possible snags etc. you would set both the spod rod and baited rod at the same distance and if your baited rod fell say 8 ft short you would re-cast.....
I have done the 1/4 rule in the past, but the more i thought about it the more it didn't make sense to me....
The problem with the variables is its an estimated guess to how much they are impacting your distance.
For a good example if you were fishing tight to an island with no possible snags etc. you would set both the spod rod and baited rod at the same distance and if your baited rod fell say 8 ft short you would re-cast.....
In reply to Post #1
I sometimes fish short of my spom mix also get the stick out and put a few scattered boillies around, different from most , tailor the situation to your swim , be different.
I sometimes fish short of my spom mix also get the stick out and put a few scattered boillies around, different from most , tailor the situation to your swim , be different.
In reply to Post #1
In reply to Post #19
What would you suggest doing then? Clipping up all at the same distance or removing 1 ft for every 4ft of water ?
What would you suggest doing then? Clipping up all at the same distance or removing 1 ft for every 4ft of water ?
In reply to Post #22
I'd suggest clipping up at the same distance
I'd suggest clipping up at the same distance
In reply to Post #23
there's an article in the online Carpology that says exactly that.
there's an article in the online Carpology that says exactly that.
I bought this video years ago but it's now up on you tube
It goes into it on here
https://youtu.be/gBZ0OOW1C7c
It goes into it on here
https://youtu.be/gBZ0OOW1C7c
In reply to Post #13
I don't really understand what you're saying? Why would you be letting the lead fall in a slack line?
I don't really understand what you're saying? Why would you be letting the lead fall in a slack line?
In reply to Post #26
I wouldn't usually, just making the point that unless the lead hits the water on a tight line it will fall through the water like a thrown stone, straight down. Drop back is a result of a tight line between the rod tip and the lead.
In terms of physics it is a pendulum that swings until it is stopped by hitting the lake bed. If the water is deeper than the length of the line the lead will swing until it hangs vertically from the rod tip. It won't continue swinging because of the damping( no pun intended) effect of the water. Where the line enters the water may have a very small effect on the system because the line is not rigid The point of suspension is the rod tip. A pendulum doesn't have a fulcrum.
I wouldn't usually, just making the point that unless the lead hits the water on a tight line it will fall through the water like a thrown stone, straight down. Drop back is a result of a tight line between the rod tip and the lead.
In terms of physics it is a pendulum that swings until it is stopped by hitting the lake bed. If the water is deeper than the length of the line the lead will swing until it hangs vertically from the rod tip. It won't continue swinging because of the damping( no pun intended) effect of the water. Where the line enters the water may have a very small effect on the system because the line is not rigid The point of suspension is the rod tip. A pendulum doesn't have a fulcrum.
I don't have answers to any of this but it sounds like everyone is taking it that the line is in a straight line at all times from the tip to the lead. When in fact different size arcs are formed by different lines. So you can never be100% accurate even with a marker as that will sink at a slower rate than a lead on its own so create less arc or fall back.
I still use a marker at distance though as I had the day off when we did maths at school.
I still use a marker at distance though as I had the day off when we did maths at school.
Applying bait at range by any method other than a boat or bait boat is inherently innacurate and the level of innacuracy grows the greater the range gets.
Anyone fishing at a hundred yards who thinks they are fishing on a "bin lid" is deluding themselves unless bin lids come in 30 ft sizes. Add wind and water conditions to that and allowing for drop back is pointless as the spread of bait will be far greater than the 3 ft allowed in 10ft of water under the 1ft for every 3ft rule of thumb.
Don't worry about it. Bait up and fish. You could also use a good tangle free rig and not feel the lead down, hey presto! no drop back. Am I allowed to say that in these days of anal retentive gurus.
Anyone fishing at a hundred yards who thinks they are fishing on a "bin lid" is deluding themselves unless bin lids come in 30 ft sizes. Add wind and water conditions to that and allowing for drop back is pointless as the spread of bait will be far greater than the 3 ft allowed in 10ft of water under the 1ft for every 3ft rule of thumb.
Don't worry about it. Bait up and fish. You could also use a good tangle free rig and not feel the lead down, hey presto! no drop back. Am I allowed to say that in these days of anal retentive gurus.
In reply to Post #27
I honestly don't understand what point you mean by this? "unless the lead hits the water on a tight line"
what situation wouldn't the lead hit on a tight line. I dont see what relevance this has?
It does pivot on the point where the line meets the water, it's different on different lines, but I've seen it with my own eyes. That point where the line meets the water moves as well, so it's impossible to calculate for different lines or water conditions.
If it falls long enough it does go from the rod tip, i worked this out from a 60ft deep pit. Cast to the middle and the marker float pops up under your feet
I honestly don't understand what point you mean by this? "unless the lead hits the water on a tight line"
what situation wouldn't the lead hit on a tight line. I dont see what relevance this has?
It does pivot on the point where the line meets the water, it's different on different lines, but I've seen it with my own eyes. That point where the line meets the water moves as well, so it's impossible to calculate for different lines or water conditions.
If it falls long enough it does go from the rod tip, i worked this out from a 60ft deep pit. Cast to the middle and the marker float pops up under your feet