Evening guys,
So I know there is a 'Carp Forum approved' recipe, and I'll take a proper look through this thread shortly.
However, aside from that thread, can anybody point me in the direction of somewhere that not only gives me a recipe, but explains what the ingredients are for, what they contribute to the nutrition of the bait etc etc.
I'm keen to start making my own baits not just from basemixes etc from the same companies I would buy the bait from, but feel it would be beneficial do understand how everything works and how I can improve my recipes etc etc.
I'd like to know that what I'm feeding the fish is beneficial to them, and of course very attractive, but hoping to use something different on fairly busy waters that should give me an advantage.
Thanks in advance for any help anyone can offer.
Aaron
So I know there is a 'Carp Forum approved' recipe, and I'll take a proper look through this thread shortly.
However, aside from that thread, can anybody point me in the direction of somewhere that not only gives me a recipe, but explains what the ingredients are for, what they contribute to the nutrition of the bait etc etc.
I'm keen to start making my own baits not just from basemixes etc from the same companies I would buy the bait from, but feel it would be beneficial do understand how everything works and how I can improve my recipes etc etc.
I'd like to know that what I'm feeding the fish is beneficial to them, and of course very attractive, but hoping to use something different on fairly busy waters that should give me an advantage.
Thanks in advance for any help anyone can offer.
Aaron
In reply to Post #1
Not to sound anti forum but there is some decent bait making groups out there on Facebook with files and info you can use to understand different ingredients and there properties.
I reccomend creating some spread sheets, and having sections such as marine animal and marine vegetal proteins, vegetable proteins milks etc then have its usual,secondary and other functions in columns, along with inclusion levels, and if you find a good link to a data sheet for it have a “links” column.
It's also handy to put a supplier Column when you find a reliable source of acceptable quality.
Nutritively speaking it's worth listing the amino acids in descending order of quantity within an ingredient, doing this when I was very young ( I think at the time I collie coded it all ) teaches you a general understanding of what's what with the basic amino acids, you learn that if you plan to use ingredient “43” as the bulk protein source you need to add ingredients “44” and “45” to balance it.
Don't try to get an exact replica of a carps requirements in bait, work on the rule of +a third if you can't to account for which of those are soluble, what might be lost to heat exposure and so on.
A word of warning - it's very addictive.
By collating your own data from different sources you create a source unique to yourself, as opposed to having to refer to lots of different pieces of information which can be overloading.
Enjoy
Not to sound anti forum but there is some decent bait making groups out there on Facebook with files and info you can use to understand different ingredients and there properties.
I reccomend creating some spread sheets, and having sections such as marine animal and marine vegetal proteins, vegetable proteins milks etc then have its usual,secondary and other functions in columns, along with inclusion levels, and if you find a good link to a data sheet for it have a “links” column.
It's also handy to put a supplier Column when you find a reliable source of acceptable quality.
Nutritively speaking it's worth listing the amino acids in descending order of quantity within an ingredient, doing this when I was very young ( I think at the time I collie coded it all ) teaches you a general understanding of what's what with the basic amino acids, you learn that if you plan to use ingredient “43” as the bulk protein source you need to add ingredients “44” and “45” to balance it.
Don't try to get an exact replica of a carps requirements in bait, work on the rule of +a third if you can't to account for which of those are soluble, what might be lost to heat exposure and so on.
A word of warning - it's very addictive.
By collating your own data from different sources you create a source unique to yourself, as opposed to having to refer to lots of different pieces of information which can be overloading.
Enjoy
In reply to Post #1
You will get some great advise here, as per below, however i would seriously think about how much time it will take up yes it is interesting but will take a long long time to actual gain the knowledge of someone like mozzi below.
Its literally another hobby and its great to catch one of your own recipe however getting it to a stage where its actually better than anything comercially available is a long shot and potentially not even possible (what is better?) what we think might be better, well the carp wont always agree. I fish a few different type of waters and the guys that make their own, cork ball pop ups an all that dont do nearly as well as some of the guys that just use commercial boilies or pellets.of course theres more to angling that just bait but certainly helps if you have somethign they want to eat.
If i were to return to baitmaking, i would hand roll all the boilies and not use an extruding gun.
You will get some great advise here, as per below, however i would seriously think about how much time it will take up yes it is interesting but will take a long long time to actual gain the knowledge of someone like mozzi below.
Its literally another hobby and its great to catch one of your own recipe however getting it to a stage where its actually better than anything comercially available is a long shot and potentially not even possible (what is better?) what we think might be better, well the carp wont always agree. I fish a few different type of waters and the guys that make their own, cork ball pop ups an all that dont do nearly as well as some of the guys that just use commercial boilies or pellets.of course theres more to angling that just bait but certainly helps if you have somethign they want to eat.
If i were to return to baitmaking, i would hand roll all the boilies and not use an extruding gun.
The last sentence sounds a bit like self punishment haha. If ever I pack up shop he extruders are staying 
In reply to Post #4
If you roll by hand or with a machine. It has a huge influence on which mixes you can process.
Some of the hardest mixes to roll on a machine catch very good!
If you roll by hand or with a machine. It has a huge influence on which mixes you can process.
Some of the hardest mixes to roll on a machine catch very good!
In reply to Post #5
True 20 years ago.
Look at baitworks very coarse mixes, look at hand crafts nut bait thst he adds nut chunks to.
You can make very coarse / umsmooth baits roll.
90% of problems come from mixes being too dry, table rolling dough is much dryer than machine rolling dough
True 20 years ago.
Look at baitworks very coarse mixes, look at hand crafts nut bait thst he adds nut chunks to.
You can make very coarse / umsmooth baits roll.
90% of problems come from mixes being too dry, table rolling dough is much dryer than machine rolling dough
In reply to Post #1
Hi Aaron,
I've been messing about making my own baits for well over 30 years now and can certainly tell you it's a great feeling when you catch on your own baits, even better when you make one that is very successful. But as Mozzie has said it can be addictive and in my case once I've found a good bait I want to start experimenting again to find another one.
I also realise that many people make there own bait to save a few pounds. That's not for me, I have made some very expensive baits and I have to be honest that I have found that some of the best ingredients are very expensive, especially in the quantities to make them effective.
I've also made loads of mistakes, but hopefully I've learned from them and still do it.
Without being specific, tips I can give are
If possible formulate your mix so as many of your ingredients are used up, keep to multiple of 5% is the wat to go or you will end up with a shed/garage full of left over ingredients.
The most nutritional baits are not necessarily the most effective, we are trying to catch them not grow them.
For each bait consider attraction, taste and nutrition and think about your fishing, do you fish the same waters week in week out, are your sessions short or long, or do you visit a lot of waters or perhaps fish busy waters. For example if you only fish short sessions then attraction is probably the most important aspect, but if you are fishing 48 hours every week on the same waters then attraction may not be so important.
Finally, if you want bait in quantity pay a professional to roll it....it makes it all easier. Nowadays I only put the powder and liquids together, I pay a local company to roll it for me.
Good luck
Hi Aaron,
I've been messing about making my own baits for well over 30 years now and can certainly tell you it's a great feeling when you catch on your own baits, even better when you make one that is very successful. But as Mozzie has said it can be addictive and in my case once I've found a good bait I want to start experimenting again to find another one.
I also realise that many people make there own bait to save a few pounds. That's not for me, I have made some very expensive baits and I have to be honest that I have found that some of the best ingredients are very expensive, especially in the quantities to make them effective.
I've also made loads of mistakes, but hopefully I've learned from them and still do it.
Without being specific, tips I can give are
If possible formulate your mix so as many of your ingredients are used up, keep to multiple of 5% is the wat to go or you will end up with a shed/garage full of left over ingredients.
The most nutritional baits are not necessarily the most effective, we are trying to catch them not grow them.
For each bait consider attraction, taste and nutrition and think about your fishing, do you fish the same waters week in week out, are your sessions short or long, or do you visit a lot of waters or perhaps fish busy waters. For example if you only fish short sessions then attraction is probably the most important aspect, but if you are fishing 48 hours every week on the same waters then attraction may not be so important.
Finally, if you want bait in quantity pay a professional to roll it....it makes it all easier. Nowadays I only put the powder and liquids together, I pay a local company to roll it for me.
Good luck
In reply to Post #6
I can give a mix that sticks like hell but catched very well. Even the best anti-stick coating on your machine will need cleaning every 20-50k. For a professional roller as you, this is an huge additional cost.
That said, I thrughly believe equipment evolved and it will all be better than 20y ago, the time I did most of my home bait making.
I can give a mix that sticks like hell but catched very well. Even the best anti-stick coating on your machine will need cleaning every 20-50k. For a professional roller as you, this is an huge additional cost.
That said, I thrughly believe equipment evolved and it will all be better than 20y ago, the time I did most of my home bait making.
In reply to Post #8
Same goes for on a table mate.
Variable speed control on either set of rollers means you can adjust “roll time” and the rollers themselves are made of PTFE, the hardest thing to put through it is cork granules pop ups due to the sheer amount of binders in the mix and it's inherent lightness doesn't assist with it getting gripped by the rollers to do down. It's really traumatising lol and upsetting that I might have to buy some shilham blades to do it on. And I haaaaaaaate using shilhams as I believe selling a product you know breaks in first time use is fraudulent lol
Same goes for on a table mate.
Variable speed control on either set of rollers means you can adjust “roll time” and the rollers themselves are made of PTFE, the hardest thing to put through it is cork granules pop ups due to the sheer amount of binders in the mix and it's inherent lightness doesn't assist with it getting gripped by the rollers to do down. It's really traumatising lol and upsetting that I might have to buy some shilham blades to do it on. And I haaaaaaaate using shilhams as I believe selling a product you know breaks in first time use is fraudulent lol
In reply to Post #6
Even with that, I had to make mixes that went through the gun 'wetter' than table rolled mixes. The table rolled mixes also had a better textured finish, smoother.
Don't get me wrong, both caught, but the table rolled bait was nicer for firing out with stick
Even with that, I had to make mixes that went through the gun 'wetter' than table rolled mixes. The table rolled mixes also had a better textured finish, smoother.
Don't get me wrong, both caught, but the table rolled bait was nicer for firing out with stick
In reply to Post #10
table rolled bait is slightly denser thats why, more compression.
but to be honest, most people cant group baits on a king size mattress at 70 yards so perfectly round bait isnt always necessary
table rolled bait is slightly denser thats why, more compression.
but to be honest, most people cant group baits on a king size mattress at 70 yards so perfectly round bait isnt always necessary
In reply to Post #1
Personally I'd just go to John Baker and get on with fishing. That's me we are all different
Personally I'd just go to John Baker and get on with fishing. That's me we are all different
In reply to Post #11
It's only for the throwing stick I want perfect round baits. Hookbait I will look for the 'offcut' or misshapen ones.
I wish I could hit that mattress; at some point I'll look 'short' and a few baits will do the same, or I do a slight sideways swing and watch it spin to the side.
For the OP, yes making your own bait is good learning, but unless you honestly think making your own base mix from scratch will improve your results, you might be better off buying a ready constructed base mix, or even ready made boilies in freezer or shelf life.
It's only for the throwing stick I want perfect round baits. Hookbait I will look for the 'offcut' or misshapen ones.
I wish I could hit that mattress; at some point I'll look 'short' and a few baits will do the same, or I do a slight sideways swing and watch it spin to the side.
For the OP, yes making your own bait is good learning, but unless you honestly think making your own base mix from scratch will improve your results, you might be better off buying a ready constructed base mix, or even ready made boilies in freezer or shelf life.
In reply to Post #12
In reply to Post #13
I love it when I get to use the left over off cuts, trouble is everyone else wants them as well!......yet not mixed in with there usually bait hence we pick em out lol madness
I love it when I get to use the left over off cuts, trouble is everyone else wants them as well!......yet not mixed in with there usually bait hence we pick em out lol madness