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In reply to Post #108
I don't personally see it as cheating oneself when it comes to changing their own physique for their own pleasure, however I do get a sense of frustration when people compete while enhanced, in sports which do offer an untested federation. I get why in top level sport everyone does it to some extent as the financial incentive is there, but in low level athletics/track and field/powerlifting/bodybuilding when people can compete without any fault in an untested federation but choose to try and cheat in a tested one, it does really wind me up. Its a pyrrhic victory at best for them and a real blow to people who want to compete naturally.
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| | | noj | | Posts: 11459 | | | Social photographer... | |
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In reply to Post #106
No medical professional would advise using them. However they can and do give advise on the safest way to use them. Most of the professionals do their work on consulting damage mitigation which they are obliged to do.
I feel like the tone of your post suggests that you do not agree with the use of PEDs and that is absolutely fine. However you suggest that it is not sportsman like behaviour to use them as a way to gain advantage over another individual. I would be in agreement with this if all other athletes were not using some kind of pharmacological enhancement, however the VAST majority of all athletes across all sports are using them, even in the areas you wouldn’t expect them to. For example many chess players will use testosterone and amphetamine derivatives for enhanced cognitive abilities and figure skaters will use testosterone for its neurological and motor pattern enhancing properties along with various peptides for damage mitigation on their joints due to the high angular velocities the sport puts on their joints.
The testing system of WADA/USADA etc are set up so that they do not catch people, or at the very least so they can catch people of their choosing. The athletes are informed of testing periods. There is a large area around the average blood androgen content which athletes are allowed to fall within, the upper limit being so outrageously higher than a normal individual to account for the freaks of nature who may potentially be in this area. Therefore, if you’re blood doesn’t naturally contain this high of a concentration, an athlete can exogenously introduce the required amount of androgens so that they are at the upper limit. there is literally NO WAY you can test for this. These athletes are simply levelling the playing field at this point. Growth hormone has a metabolic half life of a couple of hours. Athletes can use this year round as long as they don’t test for it within a few hours of administration, there is no feasible way to detect this as the metabolites of it aren’t readily detectable. There’s a huge correlation between the introduction of growth hormones in the 80s and the increased longevity of athletes in sport. Is it a coincidence? Possibly, but highly unlikely.
Another way that testing is set up to fail is that if an athlete decides they want to ‘retire’ from the sport they are no longer subjected to testing at any period. They can take a few month/years off of the sport, take as many short acting ester drugs as they want, then when they want to compete again, rejoin the sports governing body, with increased muscle mass/speed/power etc and not get caught. Sound like any professional boxers you know of?
Anyway onto your final point about the ‘juice heads’ being good research material. I hate to say it but you’re wrong. The only good research in medicine are controlled clinical trials where there is one modifiable variable. Most ‘juice heads’ are on multiple different compounds so it’s night on impossible to actually understand what is causing their altered physiology, particularly when they have deceased. However active blood work taking whilst using anabolics does provide some insight, but correlation doesn’t equal causation and there are too many variables at play to really gain any meaningful understanding.
I don’t think many are well versed on the subject of PEDs and a lot of the opinions on here are pure conjecture at best. If you want to listen to a decent podcast about doping in sport and it’s huge prevelance, go listen to any Broderick chavez podcast on Spotify as he has personally worked with many sportsmen (he doesn’t name them on the podcast) who have won Olympic medals, rugby world cups and super bowls. The information on who the individuals are is available on the internet too. So please, have a listen and see what you think about the idea of the idea of clean sport.
All the best,
Tom
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| | | noj | | Posts: 11459 | | | Social photographer... | |
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In reply to Post #104
He probably can’t say anything further as he clicked on that hyperlink and his machine has been ransomwared
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In reply to Post #103
You're replying to a bot!
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In reply to Post #102
I haven't been active on here for such a long time but I've had to come back on to address this comment.
The fact you are openly trying to promote the use of Lignadrol is ridiculous. Lignadrol is a SARM (selective androgen receptor modulator) and will suppress natural testosterone production to the same extent as any anabolic steroid through the same suppression loop of the HTPA axis. It requires the use of PCT (post cycle therapy) the same as other anabolics, or failing that, the use of exogenous testosterone continually to address the suppression.
I have no issues with the use of PEDs for sport or physique enhancement, especially when its done safely with the consultation of a medical professional. For reference, that includes doing it yourself, but consulting with a healthcare practitioner honestly when addressing the potential issues with physiology that might come as a result of it.
Most anabolic steroids that are used for sport and physique enhancement have much more extensive research and information available on them than all of the SARMs that are on the market. This means that safe usage is much more achievable because of the understanding we have of treating the associated complications. So to suggest using a relatively unknown compound, without the guidance or knowledge of the required products needed to mitigate its side effects is honestly just moronic. It shows how deep the level of misunderstanding of sports supplements that you have.
My work is in endocrinology for sports performance so if anybody has any genuine questions regarding the use of PEDs, please feel free to DM me instead of listening to this absolutely awful information on here.
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The keto diet is one of the best diets for the long term because you are essentially eating the same proteins, fats, and carbohydrates, just in a slightly different ratio. You are focusing on fats and proteins while reducing your carbohydrate intake, which is very good for your overall health. If you are a mesomorph or an endomorph, in this way you can not only lose subcutaneous fat, but even gain lean muscle mass. But if you have an ectomorph body type, you need to either add more carbohydrates to your diet, or use supplements to gain muscle mass. LGD 4033 for sale has shown itself very well in practice, because it helps to gain lean muscle mass very well.
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In reply to Post #100
You need to put a great deal of effort into your work. Put in extra-long hours if needed. Check out https://betterme.world/articles/4-day-lifting-routine/ suggestions. You can work at high intensity, completing a large volume of work outs. But big body is possible without steroids.
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In reply to Post #99
Never used steroids. Maybe I don't know any positive effect of them, but I think it's better to tran your body naturally to not deflate like a balloon in a short period.
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In reply to Post #86
It’s sounds more profitable than making bait in your shed and selling for 6 quid a kilo.
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In reply to Post #67
yes quite a bit aswell. bit of a twist as in who done it now has come out in the open.. 
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| | | noj | | Posts: 11459 | | | Social photographer... | |
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In reply to Post #83
What a waste of taxpayer’s money chasing these **** wits down 
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In reply to Post #85
No small time then mate 
Crime pays, that’s the reality, big business
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In reply to Post #84
he has also done for having 2 labs locally in the UK and making the stuff which he sold.
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In reply to Post #83
Linked to 16 tons of royds
Got away lightly there with 6 years, hardly a deterrent with good behaviour etc when you look at what they must have made!
Says he was the fixer, not the main man, there willl be some £ stashed away somewhere 
Start work, 6 years in th Nick, retire, who says crime does not pay
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In reply to Post #82
look up:
Nathan Selcon bodybuilder.
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In reply to Post #81
Be interesting to see what they get for that then, think they are a class C now?
People have been at that game for years, buy it over the counter in Spain etc.
Millions £s though, that’s mental. Probably try and spank him on the tax front, be interesting to see if he gets his property repossessed etc
Probably make the BBC news with that lot 
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Just learnt that a bloke from my old gym got busted a year ago for being part in the biggest steroid ring ever.
Him and his gang raked in millions.
Been at it for years.
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In reply to Post #78
Exactly 
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| | | mal | | Posts: 8910 |  | |
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In reply to Post #78
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In reply to Post #73
Treat people on face value, once a **** always a ****
That reminds me of this
LINK
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In reply to Post #76
All shaved off though and covered in gravy browning Jim, prefer them with a bit of fur myself 
Apparently 
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Look at the women on the gear, Jawline like desperate Dan body hair like chewbacca and you can see for yourself the size of the genitalia on Pornhub 😂 ...... so I’ve been told 
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Try to resist the temptation , you still have to sort the mess out after !
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In reply to Post #73
Ain’t that the truth.
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In reply to Post #72
Treat people on face value, once a **** always a ****
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In reply to Post #70
Strangely enough my son whose a gym freak has just popped around and we discussed the devastation left behind and in his words he says he can’t wait until the time arrives to make a mess of the builder. He’ll have to get behind me and then when he’s had his turn there’s a cage fighting mate of my son that has offered to give him a slap......
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In reply to Post #70
Can’t wait until the chartered surveyor gets hit for a few quid.
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In reply to Post #68
Currently at just over 100K to put it all right
Make know wonder your angry
You could probably get somebody shot for a fraction of that
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In reply to Post #66
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In reply to Post #65
The house was demolished a couple years later due to regeneration programme. I wish some fcuker would demolish this recurring nightmare house of my daughters.
Edit - Having said that we now seem to have a good company who is overseeing the complete devastation those previous vvankers left behind.
Currently at just over 100K to put it all right and that’s without ‘see my threads regards situation of the builders’ the current mess that’s being uncovered.
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In reply to Post #30
He died of lead poisoning didn’t he
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In reply to Post #65
Said if it wasn’t it his ex brother in law he would have sent him round to sort them out
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| | | mal | | Posts: 8910 | | |
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In reply to Post #63
did you recommend a builder for the repairs?
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Knew a bloke in 1985, he was 18 and on the gear a competitive bodybuilding. Not massive but huge potential. Doing the junior shows then the main shows. Taking growth hormones and other stuff, got massive, won a British title and hit his pro card. Went over to the States and got sponsored by Ben and Joe Weider. Trained along side all the big names then packed it all in 6 months later when he learnt how much gear all the top guys were on, and was not prepared to take that amount of gear to stand a chance of success.
Took up yoga, packed in the gear, ate the best food on the planet and slowly healed his body from years of abuse.
Reckoned he would have been dead in 5 years if he had continued with the drug abuse.
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Ex bro in law obliterated his own house one night.
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In reply to Post #60
It’s the old gypsy saying. It’s not the size of a dog in a fight, it’s the size of the fight in the dog
Now those lads do rule by the knuckle 
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To be fair the big steroid meat heads have never been unfriendly in my experience in gyms. When I started out they would always help out and give advice on training and food. Very rarely been offered gear either to be fair.
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In reply to Post #59
all about range LOL.
bodybuilders are like a side of beef. most of the really big guys I've met have been lovely
you know the fella Cobra from Gladiators. he was a regular at an 'old school' gym I used to go to.
you couldn't meet a quieter less assuming bloke. But he had to LIVE in the gym to get that size plus all the chemicals.
to be fair to him, he cycled everywhere and was also very fit. with explosive power. a cut above.
but I heard him talk about a road rage encounter he had on the way in snd he was clearly shocked. talking about how big the guy was LOL. i think it often masks insecurity
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In reply to Post #56
Size plays the intimidation game. Once saw a bouncer like you mention, massive, get the beating of his life from a lad who could fight / box. Size is not the answer, it’s being able to use it
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In reply to Post #28
sharp response fellah 
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In reply to Post #50
Exactly how I started out as a kid, boxing gym, proper **** hole, condensation on the windows and mouldy walls, stinking sweaty pile of gloves in the corner and old rusty weights. It was for training in, brilliant
The type of gyms you mention are the ones I trained in. Worked at one company for 20 years, the gym I used had a weight room and a decent floor area, just a few machines in it. Used to pass it when travelling too and from work, 40 minutes in and out, job done, no major inconvenience to my lifestyle, part of my working day, no excuse, it was just a stop off on the way too and from work when required
I have joined two gyms over the years like the ones you mentioned, signed up,,packed in after two or 3 sessions, full of tanned orange spotty backed monkeys looking at themselves in the bright lights 
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most of these guys would be much better in a boxing gym. self-confidence from genuinely being able to protect yourself
rather than hopeing that wide lats do the job.
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| | | noj | | Posts: 11459 | | | Social photographer... | |
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In reply to Post #49
You’d have to be mad wouldn’t you?
A mate of mine got big without a gym or juice on a diet of noodles, rice, eggs, biscuits and vegan sausages.. It wasn’t overnight, 5 years and 6 months I think 
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In reply to Post #51
That doesn't mean a thing to me but after reading what people have said I wouldn't 
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Jon Poll Sigmason died of a massive heart attack years ago.
Shame really it was good watching him compete on the telly at Xmas.
Geoff Capes also took a fair bit of gear as well. The owner at a gym I trained at had a mate who supplied him back in the day.
I bumped into Geoff 18 years ago. Not very mobile and the size of a house.
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In reply to Post #8
That’s why when steve Redgrave retired from rowing he still had to train every day but it so intensely and gradually slow it down as the heart is a muscle and he could have had serious problems if he didn’t
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In reply to Post #49
Only 1000mg of tren a week 
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The users have been around for years but back in the 80’s it was the serious guys using the gear. Now it’s every Tom Dick and Harry, including those who don’t understand nutrition and training routines.
I put together a home gym 15 years ago and much prefer it too bring around Tom Dick and Harry.
All the best hardcore gyms closed down years ago anyway. It’s all The corporate ones now. Gone are the old school gyms in old warehouses and old factory buildings. Big slabs of iron, not pretty but a good environment to train in.
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In reply to Post #1
Is it really that bad, if done sensible?
Well after reading everyone's comments are you going to try them?
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In reply to Post #46
Always the way... It is abuse tho.
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In reply to Post #46
Just read both stories, sad I suppose but self induced 
Davis, kidney transplant same as my mate, it’s mental 
One of the apprentices where I worked weighted 8 stone, 11.5 after around 18 months, crazy. What they should be promoting in gyms is steroid abuse. Like I mentioned below, a lot of unnecessary damage that becomes really apparent further down the line
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In terms of steroids and health google the following.
Richard farmer bodybuilder Gloucester
And
Shaun dinasour davis.
Both got messed up on the gear.
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In reply to Post #38
Just train naturally and for the long term, train hard and eat very well and be in it for the long term
Exactly that for me
Eating right is the big one, fuelling the machine, I have and had a few bad habits
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In reply to Post #43
not many lost sleep over it..
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In reply to Post #39
I was quite fascinated by the story at one time and as the truth unfolds, exactly that. Got what they deserved by the sounds of it. The old saying, there’s always somebody better
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In reply to Post #40
thats what I meant..bullies..nasty fckin bullies..that could be a different thread though..
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In reply to Post #40
Exactly that for me
If it’s a fare matched fight fair play, I’ve seen and heard of some horrendous stuff. I also know a lot of football hooligans, worst of the lot, safety in numbers, 95% of them are complete cowards when they are on their own. I fell out with a couple of lads I worked with because of that. In a pub before a game one day, about 20 of them. Two young kids come in who if they were 18 I would be surprised. Next thing 20 muppets trying to beat two youths up, ****ing ****ers 
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In reply to Post #39
Or bullies?
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In reply to Post #33
all 3 of them was nasty fckers..
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I started the gym in 1985 at 16, still at it at 51.
Never taken the gear, never wanted to.
A gym owner who I trained with in 85 to 88 ended up doing 20 years on the gear. Now he spends most of his time in hospital hooked up to various machines. He is 54 years old but looks 70.
Even at his peak he looked nothing special.
Seen loads of guys on the gear over the years, big guys but crap physiques most of them.
All the very top guys have great genetics well before taking the gear.
Just train naturally and for the long term, train hard and eat very well and be in it for the long term.
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Not much beats the synthol users,for potentially ruining their bodies.and stupidity, seen some shocking footage on YouTube...
I was always told ,strength comes from within,as long as someone is fit ,toned and healthy as can be expected ,then all is good...
Each to their own,...I guess..
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Ain’t a clue but I’ve heard of Rosie.
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In reply to Post #34
Agree. Its the 2 stone drug rat with the shooter that rules nowadays, not the knuckles
Old Glasgow saying, two good men can rule a street. Not now, its the rats with the guns and knifes
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These days it only takes them to pi$$ off the wrong person and it’s either a meeting with 🔪🔫
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In reply to Post #30
Exactly like that!
Some of my mates were into the body building and some kickboxing, they all worked on the doors. They liked the violence and I disagreed with a lot of it. Some were very decent fighters knocking piss heads out on the doors, for me totally unfair. if you want to fight, go to the gym, otherwise its self defence
Same in most towns I guess, no surprise that these lads get involved with criminal activities too, drugs, taxes!, beatings and debt collections
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In reply to Post #27
Haha should never skip leg day
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Roid rage..
Are these people firey anyway? And it just exaggerates it?
Surley it don't turn placid people in to monsters
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In reply to Post #26
sounds like pat Tate...
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Hmmm bitch tits and a small penis sounds like I don't need them.
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| | | Jon | | Posts: 4271 | | |
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Roid rage?
Shouting at cyclists in Northern Ireland?
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| | | noj | | Posts: 11459 | | | Social photographer... | |
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In reply to Post #26
The worst part about knowing these people is then socialising with this thing on little spaghetti legs with big wings and chest.. it’s like having a pint with a man size pigeon. Absolutely ridiculous, some of them sit in an office all day lol
Suppose it’s all worth it when your guns are firing out of your T-shirt with a trophy shot or carrying a cut loaf and 4 pints of milk back to the car 
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In reply to Post #18
Introduce too much steroids it will " feminise", hence bitch tits
So true, forgot to mention, another mate of mine was on the Deca and Sus. He ended up with weeping nipples 
Roid range is real, if you have knocked around with people who do roids you will know this, wife beating, anybody beating, can’t handle the testosterone levels for me, sends them nuts
One of my close mates used to go off the handle all the time. Told me one day he fell over his back door step, he had gone, kicked all the door in, garden fencing the lot, was laid on the floor punching the step. No good for the metal health either, makes even nice folk into ticking time bombs and raving lunatics. Not to mention the impact on family life too
You can see people change when you know them, brings out the ugly side off people which varies with the amount of gear they are actually taking
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In reply to Post #20
Roid rage? Bit of a cliche. Far more alcohol induced rage out there.
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In reply to Post #19
Agree with most of what you say here 
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I never touch any drugs..
But ,four yrs ago,I decided to build my core strength, so I got into isometric stretching and bodyweight calisthenics...took about a yr before I noticed any difference,I can say,apart from fishing ,Bromptoneering, bushcraft,its the best thing I have ever done for myself..
Literally, my mindset,is everywhere,most things are a gym..gates,chairs,bars,wheels on machinery,no one needs to spend or waste money on a gym...
Gyms cost money,calisthenics is everywhere..its free..
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In reply to Post #19
Me. Personally none lol
Curiosity that's all
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In reply to Post #20
Yeah great song.
If all you've got to do today is find peace of mind
Come round you can take a piece of mine
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Never heard of roid rage,
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In reply to Post #1
The negatives certainly outweigh the positives
Reduced sperm count, infertility, shrunken testicles, erectile dysfunction, baldness, breast development, increased risk of prostate cancer, severe acne, stomach pain
Heart attack or stroke, liver or kidney problems or failure, high blood pressure , blood clots , fluid retention, high cholesterol
Aggressive behaviour, mood swings, paranoia, manic behaviour, hallucinations and delusions
Damage to veins, leading to ulcers or gangrene, Hep B Hep C, HIV all from sharing needles
You wont get all of these but most definitely some of them, what ones would you like.
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In reply to Post #17
Never taken steroids or have any interest. But, if a person wanted to do them as safely as possible, if it's possible to be completely safe introducing something into your body which is naturally produced. Definately a case of too much of a good thing is bad for you. Introduce too much steroids it will " feminise", hence bitch tits. Best advice I could give is to get yourself a full health check before starting a cycle. Then go and get a health check after the cycle. Post cycle very important. Google "IPED" website. Image and performance enhancing drugs. Very informative and factually accurate site. Not looking to sell you any products, just providing good harm reduction advice for those who have taken the decision to go down that route. Sign of the times methinks. The body beautiful. At any cost for some people. Good nutrition, proper rest, generally healthy lifestyle. Saw Pumping Iron in the cinema when it first came out. Think Arnie regrets taking them. Also, if your lucky you'll be buying good fakes. Pharmaceutical grade out of the reach of most users either due to cost or they wouldn't know where to source pharmaceutical grade.
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In reply to Post #16
Yes defo an unfair advantage
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In reply to Post #15
Strange how body building and the image of a “perfect” body is predominantly drug induced at the highest levels
Au natural
That’s why I hate drug cheats in sports, I know how they can enhance people’s bodys and then they compete against people who have given it their absolute all naturally, think Olympics. Lowest of the low for me 
I read something a while ago and it said that a lot of young men that are around now will have serious health issues when they reach their 40s due to steroid abuse!
It’s the longer term damage that is the problem, not the short term “buzz”
Like most things, some people can manage themselves, some cannot sadly
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In reply to Post #14
No I'm not. Just an eye opener how many people do and seem not to have a care in the world. When all you read online is negative
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In reply to Post #1
If you're even thinking about it then there's something wrong with you and your life, you need to seek help.
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I was once got given a large bag of naposim tablets, couldn’t do it, wrong, binned them . Spent a lot of time in the gym over the years and never took any. It’s cheating for me, artificial gains
I know one lad, couldn’t get above 15 1/2 stone, managed to get to 18 plus on the gear, had to give up training the blood pressure damaged his eyes
Another 2, both friends, injecting straight into the biceps and overdosing purposely! My mate Andy had a brain haemorrhage, He was in the same hospital as Paul Ingle the boxer at the time. Terrible to see.
The other ended up with Kidney failure and a transplant...
Another mate used to compete, use to take 3 types, a builder, a weight stripper and a blocker so they couldn’t see what he was taking in his samples, pissing blood the lot, mental
I also used to work with a lad, a tanned tart, used to cycle on them on and off, spotty poser you could say, was like a yo yo, see him one month, bulked up, see him a couple later like a racing snake with the life sucked out of his arse
As well as the health problems, for me it is muscle that they can’t seem to hold onto the same when they stop, ain’t natural
My mate used to play professional rugby, Super league, they are on it out of season. If you want the real deal you want the growth hormone. I was in the gym with them one day, took my to their gym, they were pushing 2p coins between their teeth, even made their jaws and bones grow and deform the GH
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In reply to Post #11
Speaking from experience?
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In reply to Post #1
Don’t do your todger any favours either
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| | | Jon | | Posts: 4271 | | |
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In reply to Post #8
Yer some of there hearts was 4 times bigger than it should of been
Blimey, that must've been expensive come Children In Need.
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In reply to Post #7
Dose seem an easy option but are the results short lived? Do the gains just go?
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In reply to Post #6
Yer some of there hearts was 4 times bigger than it should of been
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In reply to Post #5
well for competition unless it's an all-natural comp then they cant compete without them.
and I guess people look at the big guys and feel weedy in comparison.
in reality. it does help someone not dedicated get results when their diet and lifestyle would have them spinning their wheels and making no progress at all. that's why the TOWIE and CHELSEA guys do it. run a business, party, birding it up etc. 2 nights in the gym, growth hormone and protein, and the occasional steroid. beats dedication.
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In reply to Post #1
Did it for 12 years on and off whilst competing (karate) body building.There is,nt many professional sportsmen that dont throughout their career.I would definately avoid , when you get older you will know why .All sorts of health problems and thats if you are taking what it says on the label, some if the **** that gets passed around in gyms is horiffic.Had 4 mates die 2 def steroid related and countless aquaintences die or really ill , kidney problems ,blood pressure,heart attacks, blood disorders, limbs removed. One mate pumped his leg full of horse growth hormones only to have his leg amputated.
You dont need steroids unless you are going to be a pro sportsmen.
Alot of worlds strongest men die very young alot of it steroid related,blood pressure/heart attacks.
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In reply to Post #3
Yer I have read a bit and it's never good stuff.. Why do so many people do it? Just for pur vanity reasons?
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In reply to Post #1
If you are lucky it only comes back to haunt you years later. unlucky and you can have
physical and psychological problems early on.
And either way. It's not sustainable.
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In reply to Post #1
Know a bloke who lost both legs through it can't be good for you.
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Who's done it...
Joined a new gym and seems like every 1 is on it.
Had a quick Google and seems like it's all just horror and scare stories on there.
Is it really that bad, if done sensible?
Thanks
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NON Carp stuff