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   Ultimate Milk Protein base mix?
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   Old Thread  #117 3 Feb 2019 at 9.45pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #116
Viking,
Yes. Itís Northern baits stuff
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   Old Thread  #116 3 Feb 2019 at 9.43pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #114
FPM
Daphnia Extract? Is that sold anywhere?
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   Old Thread  #115 3 Feb 2019 at 9.42pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #111
NW,
Yes, 70ml per kilo of the thick stuff.
Your mix sound pretty similar to mine, except we did not hydrolyse it further. I also used 20% krill meal.

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   Old Thread  #114 3 Feb 2019 at 9.28pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #109


My favorite hydros are Pure Aminol and Daphnia Extract. Didnít notice any overdose effect with any of these liquids.
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   Old Thread  #113 3 Feb 2019 at 9.26pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #112
I thought MM used his 'Bromelain Soup' method, BB?
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   Old Thread  #112 3 Feb 2019 at 9.23pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #83
Hi Christian,
I have always said that some substances other than AAs have an effect on attraction, nucleotides being one, but they are very much secondary to AAs. I would think if you asked MM he would say the same because he already has on another thread. His own special bait he makes is based on the attraction of three selected AAs. He doesn't use enzymes, although he could if he chose to, but will say that a true enzyme bait in terms of AA attraction is head and shoulders above any standard bait, in spite of whatever other ingredient factors it might contain.
All I'm saying is, I believe that at least 90% of attraction is down to free AAs.
I don't remember you asking me about tigers, and I don't know the answer, but I did myself, post on another thread the composition of tigers and peanuts and asked what was the attraction, considering that they had little in common.
You seem to be implying that carp have taste preferences and are capable of making choices. According to research this not the case and that their receptors merely respond to chemical signals and if their receptors tell their brain that it is food they will eat it by reflex.
In terms of a well constructed mix, no one would consider using vecon or hacho miso as a main protein.
But they are good additives to add free AAs and any other useful chemicals they may contain.
Like you said, good discussion this.
BB.

PS, did you read that UCN thread? If so I would be interested to hear you thoughts.
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   Old Thread  #111 3 Feb 2019 at 9.19pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #109


Viking, I know you used the 'good krill', 70ml per kg I recall?

I've used it a lot, and like it, 50ml was/is good for me, 100ml didn't make the bait any more effective. This was in conjunction with 5% CPSP90, and proteases to work on 35% LT94, and 10% WPC80 in the base mix. I suspect the total amount of final 'hydrolysed' content was reasonably high.
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   Old Thread  #110 3 Feb 2019 at 9.18pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #106
In my opinion they really like milk proteins, not sure it's taste though I wouldn't dismiss it, it could be the high protein content breaking down and releasing the AA' s making the bait attractive.
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   Old Thread  #109 3 Feb 2019 at 9.16pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #83
"Then if the carp actually like the taste of our bait then this will increase the amount they eat, exactly the same as humans and animals and in this case I do believe the analogy does stand up."


I agree taste is very important in bait, and often underrated.
In the tests done with krill hydro on perch (I believe it was) 5% was optimum, no changes in palatability was seen at 10%. However, for attractant purpose I believe a higher inclusion rate might be beneficial. Also I think we should consider the leakage from a bait left in the lake for any amount of time, if you want it to be on optimum level when it is picked up by the fish overdosing might be a good idea. However, when feeding some hydrolysates in near pure form (just with a thickening agent), they are picked up and spat out. This typically happens a couple of times before they are left alone. Others seem to be palatable and gets swallowed, and the carp keep searching in the area.
From my experience krill hydro can hardly be overdosed. Tank testing and experience from fishing say they will happily eat whatever you soak in it. Other hydros may differ. This may well be because of bitter peptides formed during hydrolysation.
That more factors than AAs comes in to play is strongly indicated when scientists have done comperative testing by replicating the AA content of food extracts and compared these to the real stuff.
Even thou the AA fraction is the one playing the biggest part the real stuff usually is more attractive than the AAs alone.
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   Old Thread  #108 3 Feb 2019 at 9.07pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #107
Rod Hutchinson used to think there was something in it. The taste of milks.
I also think certain carp show a taste preference.

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   Old Thread  #107 3 Feb 2019 at 8.56pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #106
I think so.
Not a scientific answer... there a lot of milk protein pop-up bases mixes now. It is possible to make a pop up for example with krill meal, dried daphnia, gammarus etc. light ingredients but milk proteins are preferred.
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   Old Thread  #106 3 Feb 2019 at 8.43pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #102
Just putting this out there, besides the nutritional attraction, Do you think certain carp like the taste of quality milk proteins ?

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   Old Thread  #105 3 Feb 2019 at 8.41pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #103
Neil.... If you want to chat about tigers, could you please start another thread, as this one keeps getting dragged off the initial question
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   Old Thread  #104 3 Feb 2019 at 8.36pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #101
Thanks a lot mate!
But it really goes better after some beer
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   Old Thread  #103 3 Feb 2019 at 8.34pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #100
Would Resistant starch have no affect on carp then?
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