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   Fermenting Boilies
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   Old Thread  #375 27 Jan 2019 at 2.17pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #373
And the venue I mentioned is the same one Mark has just posted fish from, albeit 20 odd years beforehand, and those ones weren't in there then. Shame they've gone now.
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   Old Thread  #374 27 Jan 2019 at 2.13pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #369
U.S. are wild and un pressured, hence their nomadic feeding, no amount of bait will hold them after mother natures instincts tell them a few carp have been hooked amongst them, so much water to roam in !

Pinpoint bait placement is key, over the actual proven hook bait choice. Stick with the S2 on one rod and a particle on the other, give it time.

I do not believe that there is any one bait that will select the bigger & biggest carp in your venue, whilst it swims amongst lots of singles, doubles, 20's & 30's.

An attractive bait is an attractive bait to any size carp, but Mother Nature will too often throw a spanner in the works and they will pick the odd bait only at a time, be fussy, no matter what you do or try !!
Another thing that may sway it, may be, if it is heavily overloaded with potent additives, or not. The older & wiser carp may avoid it.

Unless you have a baiting situation where you can isolate the feeding bigger fish, like in the clear margins stalking them, or a group of just big fish move in, forcing the smaller ones off the baited area.
Bait the edge where you can, watch, wait and learn, even these wild carp will do things with our super rigs that will open your eyes !!

I found one of the biggest issues besides pin point location where access was not a problem, was keeping on the feeding fish as they move.
Better Weather and Time of year are other big factors, to make them feed harder without care, gorging themselves, some natural food sources like zebra mussels and crayfish can create big feeding/holding areas, you can just catch them, pick them off and slightly move around with the shoal.

Stick with your methods, consistency is key - Happy hunting

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   Old Thread  #373 27 Jan 2019 at 2.07pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #366
They do not blow mate. They 'know' that it is crap food, in the case of rubbish type boilies. Something else is being put in by some one else, and they prefer that. You can put as much sweetcorn in as you want. If I put some 'magic' sweetcorn into that lake... They are not picking up your sweetcorn anymore. When naturals are kicking off around the lake, they will not even pick up natural baits like sweetcorn, because they are alien to their environment. A supplementary food source, being introduced by man. Put a bloodworm bed kicking off into the equation... EVERYTHING is redundant. The reason some bait brains do not understand this... Is because they know a bit about making bait... But not really as much about fishing. When you live it to, you get to see what works, and what does not. Like properly. This helps you to develop things even more.

There is a member on here, who pm'd me about bait, when I first spoke on this forum. He was asking me about boilies, but the conversation went onto something else. I gave him some advice, of something to try. He thanked me. There is no flies on him. I got a lovely pm back the other day, saying he had done what i said... And caught the biggest fish in his lake on it, straight away. He's a respected member of this forum, and does not need naming. It was nothing that was mentioned in this thread either. But simple. It caught him the biggest one in his lake, in the winter.

Below is the same fish from post 32 on this thread. Twice more, in the same eighteen month period. It also came out to one other bloke, on the same things during that time. That was the biggest fish in that lake. If things blow, why do these very big, heavily pressured UK carp all love whatever is in them so much? Because things do not blow mate. If they really want it, there is no messing about with it at feeding time.

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I wrote about some stuff on Cemtex, absolutely donkeys years ago. About some stuff on this thread. The old boys will all remember. What did I then go do? So the stuff I was talking about back then, went on to help so many normal working blokes, catch so many premium big UK carp? Maybe there was something in that stuff after all. Last time I had this username, I had just come out of hospital. I'd been very ill indeed. I wrote some stuff, other people went off and cashed in on that in some ways. Bait clinics, talks, the lot. Well TCarper is back now after seven years, but he has all these photo's this time. Like, proper photo's. Of big, heavily pressured UK carp. And it's all to do, with stuff he wrote way back when. He just knows a whole heap more now, like so much more it is unreal. Live it for seven years, you refine stuff, you get so much better at it.

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   Old Thread  #372 27 Jan 2019 at 1.57pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #371
Early 90s so it was the proper stuff all the time.. The ones with the gold labels
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   Old Thread  #371 27 Jan 2019 at 1.45pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #370
... or there was something different in that s&o bottle next year?
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   Old Thread  #370 27 Jan 2019 at 1.42pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #364
I've seen the 'blown bait' thing once, and only once, but it did occur. Many moons ago, the top rod on one lake had his fish on Solar S and O, at stupidly high levels, 20ml per 6 eggs, in a cheapo semo/soya/maize type baits. He caught more than twice that of the 'second rod'. Come the end of October, the bites stopped, though the lake had little winter form. Next season, he couldn't buy a bite, nor could others on the same flavour, even in far more HNV type Baits, even at very reduced levels of 1ml per 6 eggs. For a few years afterwards, using S & O was the kiss of death. Whether it was due to the high alkalinity being avoided, or any association with a poor basemix, I've no idea....but it happened!
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   Old Thread  #369 27 Jan 2019 at 1.09pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #366
Also been following this thread with great interest.
Over here in the US, we have rather a different problem... as you all know our waters are rather larger than the typical U.K. syndicate and ..generally.. angler pressure is much lower ‘per-carp’ and per-acre’.

So the baits that work for us are the ones Mark reminds us of, (sweetcorn, maize, tigers, hemp, maples etc). If prepared better, they catch more fish.

But an odd thing happens.. once caught once or twice in an area, the carp often get on their fins and swim elsewhere... Why not, plenty of naturals and no human disturbance. Added to our access problems this can cause location problems from time to time.

And - back to the thread’s intent - boilies seem not to register as a food source with our (local, NC) in the same way. Different in some other states, especially in the NE and West Coast.

I still experiment with boilies and hookbaits, to find a way of selectively picking up the bigger fish, but even the mythical S2 has not produced here... yet. This year may change that.

I hope to continue to read the expert thinking here , thanks all, it does get the grey matter working on a cold winters day...
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   Old Thread  #368 27 Jan 2019 at 12.45pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #366
Nick, I'm working today. I wrote two posts on here, while drinking tea. I don't have time to reply to that properly now as I'm necking a quick tea again, but I will later after work.
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   Old Thread  #367 27 Jan 2019 at 12.43pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #365
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   Old Thread  #366 27 Jan 2019 at 12.08pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #364
That is a good point about a bait blowing or not. It is usually down to excessive captures. The fish do not stop eating that bait, they 'know' it is food, however they do tend to or may become more wary eating it.

They may leave that bait alone for a couple of days before eating it, or they may start 'testing' the bait; suck and blow etc to see if it is attached to a line and hook.
That is the reason for the hair rig, even rig development, and the reason for changing baits, to improve the fishes confidence.

It could also be done by pre-baiting, increasing the amount fished over, or by creating a baited area with other foods.


I have seen carp avoid freshly introduced baits, sweetcorn, boilies, even other particles until they had been in the water for two days or more. It can take confidence to leave a boilie attached to your hook in place for two days!

I also think 'washed out' baits are a way to try to convince the fish the bait is not new, not recently introduced. I believe though that skinned fermenting baits as in the various pics earlier in the thread, are more attractive than freshly introduced washed out baits, due to the activity of the sugars and enzymes. With washed out baits, this activity has been washed out before being put into the lake losing the attraction.

How though do fermented boilies act once introduced? Is this sugar and enzyme activity going out into the water?

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   Old Thread  #365 27 Jan 2019 at 12.06pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #364
I've never bought into this bait blowing.
More like a dip in catches which happens all the time and then 'confirmation bias' takes hold and people convince themselves it's the bait. Not helped by bait companies who feel the need to keep on bringing out new baits to fuel the conspiracy. So people change bait catch one or two and 'confirmation bias' comes back into play and people convince themselves the new bait is the bollox.
Not being a bait buff I can't say so for certain but I suspect many new baits are made cheaper and inferior than there predecessors
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   Old Thread  #364 27 Jan 2019 at 11.43am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Another big misnomer with boilies, is that they get used to something, and it 'blows'. This is rubbish, it's just crap and they don't like it in the first place. Something else just works better. Anything good does not 'blow'. Natural salts, sugars, amino acids and oils do not 'blow'. Tigers and hemp have not 'blown', maggots do not 'blow', sweetcorn does not 'blow'.

I could go on and on forever. There's no need, carp do not get a mystery 'sense' that allows them to let something 'blow'. It's just man made crap in the first place. It can be masked up any way you want it, but it's just crap really.

I did not name it earlier in this thread. A video was about to come out, it would not have been right really. It was the 'Little Grey' I put two photo's of on this thread. It may have been caught on casters by a great angler. But for some four years, spanning four or five captures, it only came out on one thing. Here's another photograph of it with another lovely man called Dan this time.

Stuff does not blow, it's just no good. There is a lot of stuff being spoken about in this thread, that is good, very good. No fishing bait man can compete with mother nature. Mother nature always knows best. You need to know how to control this, but not take away any of mother natures work. Man is very good at a lot regarding attraction, but still not as great as mother nature. Ask yourself what casters actually are? They are man controlling mother nature, so that he can go fishing is what they are. Ask any pre millennial roach/carp anglers that can trot a stick float... What's the best thing since sliced bread. A 'stage' of mother nature is being controlled. Just like the sliced bread, with yeast. Everyone thinks bread is great for fishing because people feed the ducks with it...LOL. It's very attractive to fish, because there is mother nature working away.

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   Old Thread  #363 26 Jan 2019 at 5.28pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #358
Sugars
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   Old Thread  #362 26 Jan 2019 at 5.27pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #358
Would you say that is sugars on the boilies below or mould ?
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   Old Thread  #361 26 Jan 2019 at 11.33am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
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