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   Thames Record - Mind blown.
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   Old Thread  #398 19 Jul 2019 at 8.34pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Nothing news here, it's always the same story, when the carp anglers crowd move to a water in pursuit of a target fish Carps got found dead for some reason.

Maybe it could be the Thames Spirits chose to sacrifice the biggest Carp to sweep off the unwanted clowns.

Note: I live very far from this water but is the same everywhere wherever a wonderful Carp get showed on some media.
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   Old Thread  #397 19 Jul 2019 at 10.44am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #389
so true mark
Us true to the word Thames Carpers are a breed apart from the usual sheep.
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   Old Thread  #396 19 Jul 2019 at 9.23am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #394
Hi Gerry, Yes without knowing all the facts, and none of us do, it wouldnít be fair to blame one person. If the stories and rumours are true, especially regarding the fish being caught after Nick caught it, itís anybodyís guess what actually killed it.

I openly donít like the use of heavy baiting with nuts in fishing, I have genuine reasons why, and anglers that know about what this can do to fish will agree 100% So anybody that has been heavily baiting down there with them, or any other venue, high profile or otherwise would lose my respect instantly. Those things really should be banned, as there is so much confusion and conflicting views on them. They do mess up, and kill fish when used in large quantity or unprepared. Certain rigs and methods get banned on fisheries, yet the use of peanuts is ok? Strange.

The other thing I cannot make sense of, I know how quickly the miss use of nuts can effect the fish, and how drastically. Nick caught the fish back in October of last year if Iím not mistaken, thatís 9-10 months ago and the fish has very recently died.
So, did the fish die a slow lingering death as the result of Nick shovelling the peanuts in there back in October?
Did Nick put in so many peanuts back then, that the fish are still trying to eat them? Has Nick been fishing the Thames again recently, and putting lots of nuts in?

Or, are the stories about rumours that the fish was initially caught by Nick using peanuts in large or small quantity, and so all the pilgrims have been filling the place in with peanuts?
I am not accusing, or defending anybody, Iím saying if Nick did use nuts, even overdoing it, unless heís been doing so recently, why has the fish taken so long to die as a consequence?

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   Old Thread  #395 19 Jul 2019 at 8.29am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #394
the point Im making is I think its wrong to blame one person for it - very true Gerry.

But as the post NH Linear captors haven't gone public, no one can blame them, as NO ONE knows any facts what happened, other than immense angling pressure on said stretch, leading up to the additional capture/s or the carp care skills once it was banked.

But piling in silly amounts of Peanuts is a big no no, in anyone's books, more so when you are in the public eye/# media circus.
People look up to you, watch & follow you, and copy your methods, find your preferred areas. Rightly or wrongly.

The shepherd guides his sheep to the stretch. No need for that, no respect for the locals. The exact stretch location should have stayed under the radar and kept

I just hope people learn from this.

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   Old Thread  #394 19 Jul 2019 at 4.39am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #393
Yes Lee you raised a very good point about what happened AFTER Nick caught it !

I have heard rumours it was caught a couple of times after ??

and as you say when people hear about a certain bait catching a big fish its not unreasonable to think people would copy the method and try and catch it too ?
as said earlier when a big old fish suddenly gets caught a few times over a short space of time they often die it happens so often ?

we all fish for different reasons
and some people like Nick earn their living chasing and catching big fish and writing about them

so is it wrong he did his homework and found out about a someones secret fish ??? or a big fish that swims in the river Thames
and then caught it
WE will never know why that fish died it could be loads of different reasons maybe one of the people that caught it afterwards dropped it ?
the point Im making is I think its wrong to blame one person for it
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   Old Thread  #393 19 Jul 2019 at 0.04am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #389
A crying shame Mark, as I said I have no idea of the baiting arrangements on the river. People that know NH have given the impression that he always has fish welfare first and foremost, perhaps not from your account of events.
I must say, Iíd not heard of any otter sited on the stretch where NH caught the fish. This 25 kg is an example of what I mentioned earlier, about how different people gauge the term heavy baiting. I have seen people putting in sack loads of peanuts, certainly matching the 25kg you mentioned, and often more. What are these people thinking about?
For an experienced and recognised angler, to do this, even for livelihood dependency, is unforgivable and disgusting for me. I have no reason to disbelieve you, youíve always seemed as straight as a dye to me.

Not sure how true this is either but, I was talking to a mate on the blower this morning about this situation. He said, some of the anglers that have made the pilgrimage down there chasing the fish, heard that the fish had been caught at least once on peanuts. So, a lot of these people have piled in peanuts and tigers, in the quantity never seen on there before.
So many of the fish could have gorged on them, and still be doing so now, so who knows whatís coming next?
This is a second or third hand story though, so not sure how much merit it holds? Sounds plausible though considering.

What a horrible feeling though, regardless of what killed it, for the decent angler that pursued it. I once had access to a water, thanks to a friend, that held two real big fish.
I was keen then, and fished every spare moment I had after these fish. I lost one at the net one afternoon with witnesses, and before Iíd get another chance, the selfishness and stupidity of two people ended the dream.
Iím still bitter about it to this day to be honest. So, I know how you and the proper Thames anglers feel.
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   Old Thread  #392 18 Jul 2019 at 10.15pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #389
25kg of Peanuts Totally irresponsible IMHO

If that baiting up amount is true, Christ even the pioneering carpers to St Cassien in France were not piling that many Peanuts in.

So many better, more nutritional baits to use that would benefit the carp.

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   Old Thread  #391 18 Jul 2019 at 7.33pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #389
Powerful stuff mate.
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   Old Thread  #390 18 Jul 2019 at 3.57pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #389
Quod Severis Metes
Hopefully as I've no reason to doubt Mark.
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   Old Thread  #389 18 Jul 2019 at 12.20pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
I've only just got back from Brazil. I knew what had happened while I was away with the big mirror dying. There are no otters there. I have fished that stretch, and that area (surrounding stretches) for seven years after that fish. Hundreds and hundreds of nights. No Otter damage to any of the hundreds of fish I caught. Not one otter ever seen. They do not come down below Reading town centre regarding the Thames.

'The pest' (whoever gave him that nickname was a genius) was piling in peanuts by the barrel load. His friend Oli Davies, one of the 'carpy' circus divs he brought down to do the photographs and videos apparently saw an otter first day of the season 2019, on his very first night fishing LOL.... All complete rubbish and crap, to cover it up for his friend. The fish was seen swimming around distressed during the close season, they knew what was going to happen. The pest was preparing 100kg of chilli salted peanuts at a time, putting in 25kg a go by the barrel late 2018, despite having access to as much free boiled bait as he wanted. It was always going to end in tears, and had been spoken about already at the time of his stupidity. The whereabouts of that great fish, was kept from public consumption for virtually a decade. Yes people knew of it, I publicised all of my captures... KB did to. But no one knew where it was from. The area was very tranquil. In 2017 I fished the stretch all year on my own. Real Thames anglers do not do stuff like what the stupid 'carpy' circus crew like to do. The weekend after he caught it, there was fifty carp anglers up that stretch. The carpy crew he got down there to do the photos and videos, told every sod they knew where it was. The place was destroyed within a week of them finding out where it lived. It's now like Thorpe Lea. Rammed out like a day ticket. It was his fourth fish he caught from the area, and he sheeped them all off of some local lad who was fishing down there with me in 2018 anyway. The poor lad was catching, but had to go to work for three days. Their boats were already less than 100 yards apart before this. Thames anglers do not do stuff like this, we leave each other alone.

Peanuts killed that fish. I was called jealous on this forum, by people who have no clue whatsoever. I've carp fished the Thames for thirty plus years. No more, I walked away in virtual tears after what those circus freaks brought with them after his capture. Nick is no Thames angler... He had caught one Thames carp before, being taken with TH. He found out where I was catching all of those stunning fish from in 2017, and had heard about the big mirror from a local he plied with some free tackle. He cannot get a ticket to any decent lake around, for very good reasons.

He killed that fish, and no one will ever tell me any different. The fish was in rude health, and growing like stink. I watched it and fed it proper bait to grow from low 40, to 50+. It was a male fish, and never got involved in spawning with the much smaller fish. His silly carpy friends are now going around spouting on about otters... It's all bull****. Let him come to your syndicate lakes and pile in peanuts, 25kg a time. It would not be allowed to happen, and if it did, and the best fish in the country was in distress within four months, and died within six months... There would be absolutely total uproar. Rightly so too. The moment that fish was seen in distress, stories are made up to make it all 'alright'. It's not alright in my book, and it never will be. Other local Thames anglers knew the truth to, that's why there has been uproar on social media whilst I have been on the other side of the world. I never got Gardner, or Mainline down there to do stupid catch report videos, the river Thames is far to special for all of that caper... Just not to some, who do not care. Before he had caught a single fish from the area, Sticky were down there making videos. The video crew, none of them Thames anglers, social media kings. It was a complete joke, but when you earn no money whatsoever... You need to do things like this for a few pennies.

The carp circus, caught up with the river Thames.... It ended up with the best fish in the land dead within six months. They should all hang their heads in total shame. Information is golden for these type of carpers. Instagram is king. Most of them barely fish. The ones that do, are full timers on benefits. But a little bit of information is their currency. They totally ruined the river Thames in five minutes, all completely heartbreaking. The pressure that they brought with them, was always going to disperse those very special fish, the entire length of the river. But the biggun did not make it away, it was already in trouble, that is the reason why. There were some very special Thames carp in that area, the best of them in the 215 mile long river. I pray that the rest of them got away and moved on.
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   Old Thread  #388 18 Jul 2019 at 8.46am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #387
Peanuts going into a river depending on the flow etc, will have a better chance of being moved around and as you say picked up by other species. If the nuts are put in there in large quantities, and that can be any amount depending on what an individual classes as a large amount, and the carp are visiting and feeding in that area regularly, which is often the case once they get pre occupied with nuts, that is when the potential for problems start.
Studies can indicate all kinds of things, the fact is, allowing the use of peanuts on a fishery, opens the place up to a lot of risk.
There is not enough education on nuts in fishing, experienced anglers in this thread even admit theyíre not sure about them.

Iíve had a lot of first hand experience, and witnessed what happens with over use and miss use of peanuts in fishing. They have small benefit to a fish, mainly protein, apart from that itís all bad.

I donít know whether they had anything to do with the fish dying, Iím just commenting on something Iíve had experience with.
A while back peanuts were frowned upon because of a few instances similar to what Iíve mentioned. Then they became fashionable again, and over used.
If somebody is fishing for a day, just a few handfuls of peanuts is the max they should be thinking about.
Iíve seen them go in by the sack load at times, and the person putting them in might be telling everybody how great they are, and the carp love them, and anybody saying they are bad is talking ********. I know what I think, but Iím an old codger that knows different.
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   Old Thread  #387 18 Jul 2019 at 8.16am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
I think many people are forgetting the vast amounts of chub, bream, barbel that will also be eating these said peanuts. Many fish will move through stretches, different type of system to a contained lake. Unless tonnes were going in would there really be a danger of the carp not eating anything else??

Also if you read a number of studies peanuts actually are very good for fish, unless their diet is SOLELY peanuts for a PROLONGED period which is extremely unlikely to happen in a river environment considering there is multiple food sources available, miles for the fish to travel if they wish and plenty of competition.

The fish is sadly dead now, anything could of happened to it and the finger pointing is just sad really.
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   Old Thread  #386 18 Jul 2019 at 7.59am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #380
Cheers scozza, itís how it is now I think.

Peanuts can be a good bait if used sensibly, like on a day session a handful as ground bait, and not big carpets of them being put out.
Peanuts have a big draw for carp, and once they get feeding on them, they become pre-occupied usually to the point that theyíre almost drugged. Then if the peanuts start going into a water in vast amounts, the carp take little interest in other baits, as they seem to think of the nuts a bit like natural food.

Peanuts although packed with protein, lack certain other vitamins that are good for carp, so even whilst gorging on them, the nuts do very little for a carpís welfare.
Then you have the problems that come with peanuts that arenít prepared properly, they must be prepared before even thinking of putting them into the water.

Anglers arenít educated enough on these type of baits, I was on a few waters a long time ago where fish dropped in weight rapidly because of over use of them. Some people wonít accept that nuts arenít great for carp, usually because they are using them.
If I owned a fishery Iíd ban them, Iíd like to see them banned everywhere. There are lots of other bait choices, and most will benefit a carp a lot more than peanuts.

I donít know if Nick used peanuts and if so how many, I also donít know other Thames anglers bait arrangements. If nuts have been going in there, or anywhere else in big quantity, it wonít do the fish any good at all.
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   Old Thread  #385 17 Jul 2019 at 11.02pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #384
I thought they can struggle to digest too many nuts that's why some places ban all nuts
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   Old Thread  #384 17 Jul 2019 at 10.17pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #383
Not nice to see.

I genuinely have no idea about the peanut situation though, can excessive amounts of peanuts kill a fish? Was nick or anyone else even using peanuts in the quantities people are talking about?
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