In reply to Post #301
im going by smurfs recepie listed, but tweaks(if any) would be small-im not sure it would need an emulsifier, but i cannot see how it would hurt either sam, if to just keep the lipids from clotting.
im going by smurfs recepie listed, but tweaks(if any) would be small-im not sure it would need an emulsifier, but i cannot see how it would hurt either sam, if to just keep the lipids from clotting.
In reply to Post #302
My thoughts on it would be, if you are winter fishing with say a hook bait and a two or three bait stringer, i.e. fishing for a bite, and if you are lucky catching A fish, it shouldn't be a problem, but if you are hoofing it in and they are hoovering it up, then I would say lower the oil content.
What are the chances of that though??
My thoughts on it would be, if you are winter fishing with say a hook bait and a two or three bait stringer, i.e. fishing for a bite, and if you are lucky catching A fish, it shouldn't be a problem, but if you are hoofing it in and they are hoovering it up, then I would say lower the oil content.
What are the chances of that though??
In reply to Post #303
My thoughts on it would be, if you are winter fishing with say a hook bait and a two or three bait stringer, i.e. fishing for a bite, and if you are lucky catching A fish, it shouldn't be a problem, but if you are hoofing it in and they are hoovering it up, then I would say lower the oil content.
What are the chances of that though??
reverse psychology on that for me as far as im concerned-i do hoof it in during winter-and ive done pretty well as a result over the last few seasons, i just dont hoof it in whilst fishing-prefer to do it to a regime / frequency if you like around my fishing sessions, but equally you have to respect conditions beeing poorer than better -so you must fish when you feel theyres a chance-milder air temps,periods of lower pressure like the last few days for instance, afternoon sunshine, warmer wind direction-that sorta thing....i hoof it in to keep the fish in certain areas, and to keep them feeding-even if its very limited, those lipids get converted to energy-so i wouldnt take them out of the equation.
My thoughts on it would be, if you are winter fishing with say a hook bait and a two or three bait stringer, i.e. fishing for a bite, and if you are lucky catching A fish, it shouldn't be a problem, but if you are hoofing it in and they are hoovering it up, then I would say lower the oil content.
What are the chances of that though??
reverse psychology on that for me as far as im concerned-i do hoof it in during winter-and ive done pretty well as a result over the last few seasons, i just dont hoof it in whilst fishing-prefer to do it to a regime / frequency if you like around my fishing sessions, but equally you have to respect conditions beeing poorer than better -so you must fish when you feel theyres a chance-milder air temps,periods of lower pressure like the last few days for instance, afternoon sunshine, warmer wind direction-that sorta thing....i hoof it in to keep the fish in certain areas, and to keep them feeding-even if its very limited, those lipids get converted to energy-so i wouldnt take them out of the equation.
In reply to Post #297
Another point well worth considering is the protein content as it is very high in this mix, far too high imo especially considering the amino requirements are not quite met.
I prefer lower protein in winter.
Just my opinion and I am not knocking smurf or his mix, he suggested it as a budget mix anyway I think?
Another point well worth considering is the protein content as it is very high in this mix, far too high imo especially considering the amino requirements are not quite met.
I prefer lower protein in winter.
Just my opinion and I am not knocking smurf or his mix, he suggested it as a budget mix anyway I think?
In reply to Post #305
Not been carping since the summer so I will answer this from my armchair
the protein content as it is very high in this mix, far too high imo especially considering the amino requirements are not quite met.
I don't quite get this statement....are you sure that says what you meant it to say?
As to 50% crude protein being high...If you take into account the limiting amino acids and if we assume that 80% of the crude protein is digestible (a figure I have used as an 'average', not based on hard facts for this mix) then we have a digestible content of circa 30-35% protein
Thats a very good basis for an HNV bait to me 
The BM1 is a basis for so many other things i.e. add some liver powder, yeast and shell fish extract for a 'natural' flavoured bait or bulk it out with bird food in the late spring for a high energy bait. You can do lots with this as a base....it doesn't cost much to mix up but that makes it good value not budget
sits back in to armchair again
Not been carping since the summer so I will answer this from my armchair
the protein content as it is very high in this mix, far too high imo especially considering the amino requirements are not quite met.
I don't quite get this statement....are you sure that says what you meant it to say?
As to 50% crude protein being high...If you take into account the limiting amino acids and if we assume that 80% of the crude protein is digestible (a figure I have used as an 'average', not based on hard facts for this mix) then we have a digestible content of circa 30-35% protein
Thats a very good basis for an HNV bait to me The BM1 is a basis for so many other things i.e. add some liver powder, yeast and shell fish extract for a 'natural' flavoured bait or bulk it out with bird food in the late spring for a high energy bait. You can do lots with this as a base....it doesn't cost much to mix up but that makes it good value not budget
In reply to Post #306
Hi Smurf
I have a terrible habit of rubbing people up the wrong way, so I shall tread very carefully with this one!
That is what I meant to say, this is a cheapER mix, I should have said (I was basically saying I am sure you can come up with better)
It is high protein and yes not all of it is available- not quite what I would go for in winter.
Imo in winter it is even more important to not drain the carps system and to get it bob on.
I would favour a lower protein bait that has high BV where non of the protein is wasted and amply meets the carps aa requirement. Such a mix would obviously cost more money
It is very good of you to put a mix up, so please don't think I am slating you.
Would I put a lower protein/ high bv mix up? NO! So I guess that is all I have to say!
Hi Smurf
I have a terrible habit of rubbing people up the wrong way, so I shall tread very carefully with this one!
That is what I meant to say, this is a cheapER mix, I should have said (I was basically saying I am sure you can come up with better)
It is high protein and yes not all of it is available- not quite what I would go for in winter.
Imo in winter it is even more important to not drain the carps system and to get it bob on.
I would favour a lower protein bait that has high BV where non of the protein is wasted and amply meets the carps aa requirement. Such a mix would obviously cost more money
It is very good of you to put a mix up, so please don't think I am slating you.
Would I put a lower protein/ high bv mix up? NO! So I guess that is all I have to say!
In reply to Post #307
I would favour a lower protein bait that has high BV where non of the protein is wasted and amply meets the carps aa requirement. Such a mix would obviously cost more money
Give us an example Sam
I would favour a lower protein bait that has high BV where non of the protein is wasted and amply meets the carps aa requirement. Such a mix would obviously cost more money
Give us an example Sam
In reply to Post #307
You are not rubbing me up the wrong way at all Just felt your post deserved a response 
You are not rubbing me up the wrong way at all
Just felt your post deserved a response
In reply to Post #308
If you re read my post, you will see that I am not willing to post any of my mixes up.
Why should I? I have worked hard to get the mixes how I want them, why shouldn't others?
If you re read my post, you will see that I am not willing to post any of my mixes up.
Why should I? I have worked hard to get the mixes how I want them, why shouldn't others?
In reply to Post #310
And if you read my post Sam I'm not asking you to post up details of your mixes.....I'm asking for an example of the type of ingredients/mix you describe.....doesn't have to be one of your secret mixes
And if you read my post Sam I'm not asking you to post up details of your mixes.....I'm asking for an example of the type of ingredients/mix you describe.....doesn't have to be one of your secret mixes
To be fair on Sam, it is much easier to criticise others efforts than it is to open yourself up for the same criticism 
In reply to Post #312
Should have known I was opening up myself for this!
I certainly did not critisise smurf or his mix, think I made that clear and praised him for posting it up.
Are you asking what ingredients have high biological value? Do a search!
Should have known I was opening up myself for this!
I certainly did not critisise smurf or his mix, think I made that clear and praised him for posting it up.
Are you asking what ingredients have high biological value? Do a search!
In reply to Post #313
Don't be so defensive Sam - Im sure nobody thinks you are knocking Peter's mix. I understand what biological value is thanks so can give google a miss on that.
I'm not asking what ingredients have a high biological value. You said in your earlier post that you would prefer a bait with lower crude protein levels but a higher biological value..... I'm simply asking you for an example of such a bait, as it's your stated preference.....can you give one?
Don't be so defensive Sam - Im sure nobody thinks you are knocking Peter's mix. I understand what biological value is thanks so can give google a miss on that.
I'm not asking what ingredients have a high biological value. You said in your earlier post that you would prefer a bait with lower crude protein levels but a higher biological value..... I'm simply asking you for an example of such a bait, as it's your stated preference.....can you give one?
In reply to Post #314
OK what I meant was I would rather get my protein content from high BV ingredients apposed to things like soya flour and supergold 60.
Supergold 60/ prairie meal is supposed to have a high bv, and maybe it has for cattle etc, but for carp? I just don't agree with it.
I would rather balance aa profile with things such as higher levels of cpsp90, krill, wpc80, other refined milks, spirulina, high grade liver powder etc etc. No doubt someone will claim that refined milks are not digestible but it is my opinion that they are.
Just my opinion of coarse
You originally said- .....I'm asking for an example of the type of ingredients
But you then said you weren't asking for the ingredients
You also said- I'm not asking you to post up details of your mixes
I am confused but maybe that's the festive drinks! Hopefully I have told you all you needed to know
OK what I meant was I would rather get my protein content from high BV ingredients apposed to things like soya flour and supergold 60.
Supergold 60/ prairie meal is supposed to have a high bv, and maybe it has for cattle etc, but for carp? I just don't agree with it.
I would rather balance aa profile with things such as higher levels of cpsp90, krill, wpc80, other refined milks, spirulina, high grade liver powder etc etc. No doubt someone will claim that refined milks are not digestible but it is my opinion that they are.
Just my opinion of coarse
You originally said- .....I'm asking for an example of the type of ingredients
But you then said you weren't asking for the ingredients
You also said- I'm not asking you to post up details of your mixes
I am confused but maybe that's the festive drinks! Hopefully I have told you all you needed to know
In reply to Post #315
Thanks Sam......tells me just what I needed to know
Thanks Sam......tells me just what I needed to know