In reply to Post #195
My biggest issue is that i cant see there is any way in effectively fencing it?
Ski club, Searles Farm lane (cant put an otter fence across a road), the Flint bank is RDAA and too narrow to put a fence on whilst still making it possible to use the path - im sure there are other areas as havent been there for a few years.
Fair play for trying to do something proactive, but i've no interest in a weekend on the Blue pool with people i dont know so i'm out.....
My biggest issue is that i cant see there is any way in effectively fencing it?
Ski club, Searles Farm lane (cant put an otter fence across a road), the Flint bank is RDAA and too narrow to put a fence on whilst still making it possible to use the path - im sure there are other areas as havent been there for a few years.
Fair play for trying to do something proactive, but i've no interest in a weekend on the Blue pool with people i dont know so i'm out.....
To be fair i can understand the lads frustration and it just about sums up where we are now with otters. You have old fish here that are remarkable creatures and something furry comes along and not an eyelid is battered and its the same across the country. No different to cormorants for me, should be able to apply for a license and shoot them 
Once again we have to take it on the chin. We can spend literally millions of pounds fencing fisheries, never mind the maintenance costs to protect fish from a threat that never existed for a long time, hence, massive fish in un- tampered waters all over the country. Now some do good'er's release otters and they spread like wild fire, no different to vermin and they should be treat that way for me.
£100k for a fence or £200 for an air rifle. Such is society eh!
The species died off for a reason, natural selection. There is a place for them no doubt and that is rivers, or RSPB reserves lol, wonder if they will start fencing these off. The key is, the numbers need capping and locations need to be controlled ASAP.
Once again we have to take it on the chin. We can spend literally millions of pounds fencing fisheries, never mind the maintenance costs to protect fish from a threat that never existed for a long time, hence, massive fish in un- tampered waters all over the country. Now some do good'er's release otters and they spread like wild fire, no different to vermin and they should be treat that way for me.
£100k for a fence or £200 for an air rifle. Such is society eh!
The species died off for a reason, natural selection. There is a place for them no doubt and that is rivers, or RSPB reserves lol, wonder if they will start fencing these off. The key is, the numbers need capping and locations need to be controlled ASAP.
In reply to Post #197
Off memory 34 RSPB Reserves had been “Predator Fenced” (Political Correct name for an Otter Fence!)By March 2018, probably most have them have been fenced by now.
As for fencing this lake, I can't get over the fact as to why the hell has a fence not already been installed? Everybody and their dog know what happens if you have Carp in a lake that's not protected, it's been absolutely documented to death “Fence it OR forget it!” With such a stamp of fish, it should have been top priority going back to around 2011
I know lake owners who have had helped the Members install Otter Fences themselves to keep costs down, doing large sections every year until complete, not small waters either 40 acre plus.
Off memory 34 RSPB Reserves had been “Predator Fenced” (Political Correct name for an Otter Fence!)By March 2018, probably most have them have been fenced by now.
As for fencing this lake, I can't get over the fact as to why the hell has a fence not already been installed? Everybody and their dog know what happens if you have Carp in a lake that's not protected, it's been absolutely documented to death “Fence it OR forget it!” With such a stamp of fish, it should have been top priority going back to around 2011
I know lake owners who have had helped the Members install Otter Fences themselves to keep costs down, doing large sections every year until complete, not small waters either 40 acre plus.
In reply to Post #197
I thought otter numbers declined rapidly due to hunting initially and then poisoning by pesticides? I'm not sure that would be classed as natural selection. Anyway it makes no difference, they are back in numbers and pose a threat to every fishery that isn't fenced.
I just think it's sad that the current members would rather beg than put their own hands in their own pockets to fund this. As an example, even if there are only 20 members, £5,000 each isn't exactly a fortune (for most). If they arranged a loan over 10 years then you're looking at £1,000 per month (very roughly), so £50 a month for 20 of them.
I thought otter numbers declined rapidly due to hunting initially and then poisoning by pesticides? I'm not sure that would be classed as natural selection. Anyway it makes no difference, they are back in numbers and pose a threat to every fishery that isn't fenced.
I just think it's sad that the current members would rather beg than put their own hands in their own pockets to fund this. As an example, even if there are only 20 members, £5,000 each isn't exactly a fortune (for most). If they arranged a loan over 10 years then you're looking at £1,000 per month (very roughly), so £50 a month for 20 of them.
In reply to Post #196
I think this is the biggest issue, trying to raise over 100k before even confirming the fencing is feasible. Get the permissions all signed off from the relevant authorities and landowners/tenants and then ask for the money. Right now they could raise the money and then not get permissions meaning they need to return the money.
Also;
- RSPB have predator fenced almost all their reserves I believe
- Enut is right, otters didnt die out from natural selection, it was man that killed them off by huntin and pesticide poisoning.
I think this is the biggest issue, trying to raise over 100k before even confirming the fencing is feasible. Get the permissions all signed off from the relevant authorities and landowners/tenants and then ask for the money. Right now they could raise the money and then not get permissions meaning they need to return the money.
Also;
- RSPB have predator fenced almost all their reserves I believe
- Enut is right, otters didnt die out from natural selection, it was man that killed them off by huntin and pesticide poisoning.
I wonder if Red Kites will be the next 'reintroduced' problem especially for the RSPB, they are already causing problems LINK
In reply to Post #199
Only one person who should be fencing it for me and that's the owners if they really gave a **** and were interested. One thing it does show is that the lads fishing it are passionate about protecting the stock. Sounds like the bloke taking the ticket money is not
Only one person who should be fencing it for me and that's the owners if they really gave a **** and were interested. One thing it does show is that the lads fishing it are passionate about protecting the stock. Sounds like the bloke taking the ticket money is not
In reply to Post #197
Can't agree with you there scozza
I know it's not a popular opinion on here but I don't see the otters as the problem. They are wild creatures doing what nature intended. They had to have a release programme because of over hunting and destruction to habitat.
The problem is commercial fishery owners not adequately protecting their assets. Defiant has it right. Why the hell haven't they been protecting this key fish for the last ten years?
You wouldn't leave your front door wide open and then say 'why can't I just shoot any chancer that tried to come in and nick my telly?'
Can't agree with you there scozza
I know it's not a popular opinion on here but I don't see the otters as the problem. They are wild creatures doing what nature intended. They had to have a release programme because of over hunting and destruction to habitat.
The problem is commercial fishery owners not adequately protecting their assets. Defiant has it right. Why the hell haven't they been protecting this key fish for the last ten years?
You wouldn't leave your front door wide open and then say 'why can't I just shoot any chancer that tried to come in and nick my telly?'
In reply to Post #186
I feel your frustration it must be hard being on such a lake with the quality of fish knowing that at any minute it could all be taken away and there's little you can do about it
As a carp fisherman on another syndicate we went through this 4 years ago and all agreed to pay an extra £100 initially and then £50 per year to help with the costs
The owners have shown us the costings and we assisted with the installation
I am now on a different syndicate but do not begrudge the money I paid out to help protect the lakes
I think had you approached it differently and had costings, agreements etc in place and tried your fundraising to help you may have received a better response
Yours is not the only lake going through this.
Had all members paid an extra £100 per year over the last 6 years at 30 members you would now be £18000 towards your costs.
I believe every carp angler would love to see all fisheries fenced or better the still the otter population controlled but until then we all need to stand together.
I feel your frustration it must be hard being on such a lake with the quality of fish knowing that at any minute it could all be taken away and there's little you can do about it
As a carp fisherman on another syndicate we went through this 4 years ago and all agreed to pay an extra £100 initially and then £50 per year to help with the costs
The owners have shown us the costings and we assisted with the installation
I am now on a different syndicate but do not begrudge the money I paid out to help protect the lakes
I think had you approached it differently and had costings, agreements etc in place and tried your fundraising to help you may have received a better response
Yours is not the only lake going through this.
Had all members paid an extra £100 per year over the last 6 years at 30 members you would now be £18000 towards your costs.
I believe every carp angler would love to see all fisheries fenced or better the still the otter population controlled but until then we all need to stand together.
In reply to Post #203
Were talking otters here, not humans, same could be said for Cormorants
Saying that there's a few humans i would probably like to shoot if i could get away with it
Read 199. Like i said
Were talking otters here, not humans, same could be said for Cormorants
Saying that there's a few humans i would probably like to shoot if i could get away with it
Read 199. Like i said
In reply to Post #203
Natural otters i agree with. The problem (although its pretty academic now given it has already happened) was the release of otters without any study or understanding of the relocation site/environments.
My parents used to live in Hampshire and the river Itchen where they were has had a pair of otters there for 20 odd years, and is successful (and too expensive for me!) beat of river with natural brown trout (ie not repeatedly stocked).
The other factor is that the otters main food source is so much scarcer than when they were more wide spread (Eels).
I love seeing natural otters in the wild, however i despise the way that they were bred and then just released without any study or due care and attention. A slow reintroduction with relevant environmental considerations to allow them to find a natural balance over time would have been much, much better.
All IMO of course.
Natural otters i agree with. The problem (although its pretty academic now given it has already happened) was the release of otters without any study or understanding of the relocation site/environments.
My parents used to live in Hampshire and the river Itchen where they were has had a pair of otters there for 20 odd years, and is successful (and too expensive for me!) beat of river with natural brown trout (ie not repeatedly stocked).
The other factor is that the otters main food source is so much scarcer than when they were more wide spread (Eels).
I love seeing natural otters in the wild, however i despise the way that they were bred and then just released without any study or due care and attention. A slow reintroduction with relevant environmental considerations to allow them to find a natural balance over time would have been much, much better.
All IMO of course.
In reply to Post #206
Sense... which they didn't have, and still don't have unfortunately.
But this needn't turn in to an otter thread. We already have one of those.
Sense... which they didn't have, and still don't have unfortunately.
But this needn't turn in to an otter thread. We already have one of those.
In reply to Post #205
I think there'd be more humans on my list tbh!
Greekskii - agreed. This isn't really about otters. They never asked me to crowd fund anything
I think there'd be more humans on my list tbh!
Greekskii - agreed. This isn't really about otters. They never asked me to crowd fund anything
In reply to Post #197
The released otters would've been the ones dying by means of natural selection but some nutters keep putting carp into lakes that they can maim at will.
The released otters would've been the ones dying by means of natural selection but some nutters keep putting carp into lakes that they can maim at will.
In reply to Post #209
Ecological balance will not be attained if the biomass of the food source is artificially maintained or increased. It's why Grouse and Pheasant shoots need gamekeepers.( An oversimplification I know but an example to get the point across ).
Ecological balance will not be attained if the biomass of the food source is artificially maintained or increased. It's why Grouse and Pheasant shoots need gamekeepers.( An oversimplification I know but an example to get the point across ).