In reply to Post #30
Yes. So if you are using a leader, neither is more dangerous.
Yes. So if you are using a leader, neither is more dangerous.
In reply to Post #31
No, using a clip or running setup is far more dangerous. It's also very obvious
No, using a clip or running setup is far more dangerous. It's also very obvious
In reply to Post #32
How is it very obvious
Whats the difference between a leadclip with leader, a running rig witha leader and a helicopter witha leader that has dropped the lead?
How is it very obvious
Whats the difference between a leadclip with leader, a running rig witha leader and a helicopter witha leader that has dropped the lead?
In reply to Post #33
Nothing between those. As I wrote earlier when a Heli is used properly (NOT dropping the lead) ,that is the safest way to fish a leader. If you want to use a leader, use a Heli with the lead fixed. Nothing else is a where near as safe when using leaders.
Using leaders with anything other that that setup is foolish and dangerous.
Nothing between those. As I wrote earlier when a Heli is used properly (NOT dropping the lead) ,that is the safest way to fish a leader. If you want to use a leader, use a Heli with the lead fixed. Nothing else is a where near as safe when using leaders.
Using leaders with anything other that that setup is foolish and dangerous.
In reply to Post #34
This may not go down well but hey its my opinion.
I wonder what % of fish actually fall foul to a leader still being on after a break off, I bet its negligible. Yet for some reason people keep banging on about it . I've always used leaders and in my fishing id say 90% also do in some form, never cracked off using one and never snapped off with a fish on, so to me I see its as such a minimal risk, I do not see the issue. If they are allowed then use them if you want and if the fishery bans then follow their rules. As with all carp fishing now, people like moaning and have nothing else in their lives. (not aimed at anyone in particular)
lets compare to something else, I bet quite a few blokes on here have a couple of beers and then drive, the risk of crashing and killing someone is higher right but you make that decision. This could also be classed as being foolish and dangerous, along with lots of other every days things. but we take a risk, its in our nature to do so.
I would say the risk of a a carp dying or being damaged by use of a leader is extremely low when looking at the entire uk carp population. More chance of a carp dying due to distress of being caught and handled etc but we still go fishing don't we.
This is just my view on it.
This may not go down well but hey its my opinion.
I wonder what % of fish actually fall foul to a leader still being on after a break off, I bet its negligible. Yet for some reason people keep banging on about it . I've always used leaders and in my fishing id say 90% also do in some form, never cracked off using one and never snapped off with a fish on, so to me I see its as such a minimal risk, I do not see the issue. If they are allowed then use them if you want and if the fishery bans then follow their rules. As with all carp fishing now, people like moaning and have nothing else in their lives. (not aimed at anyone in particular)
lets compare to something else, I bet quite a few blokes on here have a couple of beers and then drive, the risk of crashing and killing someone is higher right but you make that decision. This could also be classed as being foolish and dangerous, along with lots of other every days things. but we take a risk, its in our nature to do so.
I would say the risk of a a carp dying or being damaged by use of a leader is extremely low when looking at the entire uk carp population. More chance of a carp dying due to distress of being caught and handled etc but we still go fishing don't we.
This is just my view on it.
In reply to Post #35
So you're comparing it to drink driving but saying it's ok in your book?
Edit: I do use leaders, but that is one strange analogy mate
So you're comparing it to drink driving but saying it's ok in your book?
Edit: I do use leaders, but that is one strange analogy mate
In reply to Post #36
it is a bit extreme I know lol
maybe drinking and fishing in general may have been better ha
its about the risk of something happening.
it is a bit extreme I know lol
maybe drinking and fishing in general may have been better ha
its about the risk of something happening.
In reply to Post #35
That's a very strange outlook. And a very poor one too, especially your comparison to drink driving. People who do that are ****s. Why do you use leaders for most of your fishing? Is it because the situation warrants it? Or just for the sake of it? Don't get me wrong I'll use them ,but only when needed and then set up the safest possible way,which is the one I've mentioned. Not sure what to make of your comment about moaning and having nothing in their lives. Very weird assumption. Some of us just aren't blasé when it comes to fish care
That's a very strange outlook. And a very poor one too, especially your comparison to drink driving. People who do that are ****s. Why do you use leaders for most of your fishing? Is it because the situation warrants it? Or just for the sake of it? Don't get me wrong I'll use them ,but only when needed and then set up the safest possible way,which is the one I've mentioned. Not sure what to make of your comment about moaning and having nothing in their lives. Very weird assumption. Some of us just aren't blasé when it comes to fish care
In reply to Post #33
A heli is the only set up that 'in theory' leaves the fish with ONLY the hooklink, therefore it is the safest option with a leader (if fished without dropping the lead)
A leadclip, or running lead set up will ALWAYS leave the fish towing the hooking AND the leader, regardless of dropping the lead or not.
A heli is the only set up that 'in theory' leaves the fish with ONLY the hooklink, therefore it is the safest option with a leader (if fished without dropping the lead)
A leadclip, or running lead set up will ALWAYS leave the fish towing the hooking AND the leader, regardless of dropping the lead or not.
In reply to Post #38
As I said its my view, I just choose to use leaders as the risk of a carp dying or being damaged is negligible. why do I use a leader? in my experience:
1. prevents tangle
2. helps with concealment
3. better when playing fish (against fish flanks as opposed to thinner mono)
4. more abrasion in weed, mussels, bars etc.
and these positives outweigh the chance of a leader killing or damaging a carp.
As I said its my view, I just choose to use leaders as the risk of a carp dying or being damaged is negligible. why do I use a leader? in my experience:
1. prevents tangle
2. helps with concealment
3. better when playing fish (against fish flanks as opposed to thinner mono)
4. more abrasion in weed, mussels, bars etc.
and these positives outweigh the chance of a leader killing or damaging a carp.
In reply to Post #40
So nothing a bit of rig tubing doesn't fix? Other than the abrasion thing which lets be honest really isn't an issue on the majority of waters. And for most anglers I'd guess(pray) that they actually saw getting a tangle or having a slightly blatant rig as far less of an issue than tethering and potentially killing a carp.
So nothing a bit of rig tubing doesn't fix? Other than the abrasion thing which lets be honest really isn't an issue on the majority of waters. And for most anglers I'd guess(pray) that they actually saw getting a tangle or having a slightly blatant rig as far less of an issue than tethering and potentially killing a carp.
In reply to Post #16
Leaders are banned on my club waters, and this seems to becoming more wide spread. I use lead clips with tubing, as do most others. I would use this new heli kit if the silt was deep enough to make a heli necessary. However I would always set it up so I did not drop the lead. As I said in a previous post I would have to set the lower and upper beads at the depth of the silt and fish a tight line as I have found in the past that fish get away with rejecting the bait more easily unless the travel is limited and the line is tight. Obviously fish do get caught with a long gap between beads and slacker lines but I think that is less efficient.
Leaders are banned on my club waters, and this seems to becoming more wide spread. I use lead clips with tubing, as do most others. I would use this new heli kit if the silt was deep enough to make a heli necessary. However I would always set it up so I did not drop the lead. As I said in a previous post I would have to set the lower and upper beads at the depth of the silt and fish a tight line as I have found in the past that fish get away with rejecting the bait more easily unless the travel is limited and the line is tight. Obviously fish do get caught with a long gap between beads and slacker lines but I think that is less efficient.
In reply to Post #41
How much safer is tubing that a soft supple leader really?
90% of crack offs leave a curly pig tail on the line, if your tubing slides up the line its getting jammed 10ft up the line. At least the leader stays put.
The only safe rig is the one without a hook.
How much safer is tubing that a soft supple leader really?
90% of crack offs leave a curly pig tail on the line, if your tubing slides up the line its getting jammed 10ft up the line. At least the leader stays put.
The only safe rig is the one without a hook.
In reply to Post #43
Well it can come off because it's not actually tied on so rather a lot safer as there is the probability it will come off. With a leader thats impossible unless using a Heli with the lead still attached. And with the curly pig tail you mentioned, if the lead is still attached it will act as an anchor point and therefore the pig tail has a chance of sliding through said tubing
I agree that the only safe rig is the one without a hook, but that's not much use when angling is it? As anglers we have a responsibility to fish in the safest way possible, and using leaders unnecessarily, and in the dangerous way some of you seem to like, just ain't being responsible.
Well it can come off because it's not actually tied on so rather a lot safer as there is the probability it will come off. With a leader thats impossible unless using a Heli with the lead still attached. And with the curly pig tail you mentioned, if the lead is still attached it will act as an anchor point and therefore the pig tail has a chance of sliding through said tubing
I agree that the only safe rig is the one without a hook, but that's not much use when angling is it? As anglers we have a responsibility to fish in the safest way possible, and using leaders unnecessarily, and in the dangerous way some of you seem to like, just ain't being responsible.
In reply to Post #44
So a cracked off lead clip, dumped the lead, and leaves the fish trailing hooklink with line and tubing. And you think the tubing has a high chance of sliding off the line?
Id put money that there is a higher chance that the tubing slides up the line and gets jammed, or jist stays put.
I in no way think that tubing is safer than a leader, and in fact in some situations can be more dangerous.
The second you crack off, or get cut off under tention, the chances are its leaving either a pig tail or a tangled mess, and it really wont take a lot to stop tubing sliding off, even jist the tiniest bit of weed or debris.
So a cracked off lead clip, dumped the lead, and leaves the fish trailing hooklink with line and tubing. And you think the tubing has a high chance of sliding off the line?
Id put money that there is a higher chance that the tubing slides up the line and gets jammed, or jist stays put.
I in no way think that tubing is safer than a leader, and in fact in some situations can be more dangerous.
The second you crack off, or get cut off under tention, the chances are its leaving either a pig tail or a tangled mess, and it really wont take a lot to stop tubing sliding off, even jist the tiniest bit of weed or debris.