In reply to Post #15
Agreed. However just because the info is there it doesn't mean everyone reads or adheres to it.
Personally I am not comfortable using lead core any time, anywhere but I can see that in the right hands and right situation then maybe it has a use.
Agreed. However just because the info is there it doesn't mean everyone reads or adheres to it.
Personally I am not comfortable using lead core any time, anywhere but I can see that in the right hands and right situation then maybe it has a use.
In reply to Post #15
I agree with you, no question and it's great that fish safety continues to be a priority.
However, look through the threads and the questions and problems that come up time after time. There are a lot of people out there struggling with the absolute basics. They have a major problem because most journalists, media faces etc don't want to approach a really basic how to series and a few would struggle. Major gap in provision.
I agree with you, no question and it's great that fish safety continues to be a priority.
However, look through the threads and the questions and problems that come up time after time. There are a lot of people out there struggling with the absolute basics. They have a major problem because most journalists, media faces etc don't want to approach a really basic how to series and a few would struggle. Major gap in provision.
In reply to Post #17
I would disagree. It all out there, you just have to Google it. The problem is that some idiots cant be bothered to look for it or simply dont care.
I would disagree. It all out there, you just have to Google it. The problem is that some idiots cant be bothered to look for it or simply dont care.
In reply to Post #18
I agree. A simple google search is a it takes and there's loads of information. Fishing safely is the responsibility of the angler and nobody else. If people misuse tackle it's not the tackle company's fault. People don't blame the car companies for drink drivers do they. Some anglers are lazy, and sadly as Yonny says, some simply don't care.
I agree. A simple google search is a it takes and there's loads of information. Fishing safely is the responsibility of the angler and nobody else. If people misuse tackle it's not the tackle company's fault. People don't blame the car companies for drink drivers do they. Some anglers are lazy, and sadly as Yonny says, some simply don't care.
In reply to Post #19
Someone mentioned regular rig checks as being a suitable solution. It is not imo. Stopping guys after they've already done it is backwards. I think there should be a simple theory test to obtain the rod license. So anglers are forced to educate themselves.
Someone mentioned regular rig checks as being a suitable solution. It is not imo. Stopping guys after they've already done it is backwards. I think there should be a simple theory test to obtain the rod license. So anglers are forced to educate themselves.
In reply to Post #18
Yonny
So lets test your theory of the information is all out there.
I'm new to the sport and I google "Korda leadcore dropping the lead" and I click onto ......
https://carptalk.uk/rigs/heli-safe-system/
A very nice informative website.
I then pitch up next to you on a premier carp water and you wander over to help me land a stunning carp and you start spitting feathers after seeing that I've dropped my lead on leadcore.
As a new idiotic angler to the sport what have I done wrong?
There is information out there and for the new anglers who do search, much of it is wrong and dangerous!
Until this changes, it is also wrong to label all anglers who make mistakes as idiots
Yonny
So lets test your theory of the information is all out there.
I'm new to the sport and I google "Korda leadcore dropping the lead" and I click onto ......
https://carptalk.uk/rigs/heli-safe-system/
A very nice informative website.
I then pitch up next to you on a premier carp water and you wander over to help me land a stunning carp and you start spitting feathers after seeing that I've dropped my lead on leadcore.
As a new idiotic angler to the sport what have I done wrong?
There is information out there and for the new anglers who do search, much of it is wrong and dangerous!
Until this changes, it is also wrong to label all anglers who make mistakes as idiots
In reply to Post #21
If you Google "Korda leadcore dropping the lead" did you expect to find anything other than the Heli Safe?
Googling "ESP dropping the lead" would likely see something from ESP (in fact I just did that and it shows the ESP guide to drop-off inlines on leadcore). Same deal.
Now if we Google "safe carp angling" which would make much more sense for someone trying to find out about safe carp angling, you immediately hit countless videos and articles on safe carp angling.
This is basically just the same discussion about the safety of leadcore that's been going on for years and years - since lead core was introduced. The Heli Safe is just the same as any other lead clip or drop off system. Nothing has changed. This is a burnt out subject as you said in your initial post (but no less important for it). There are threads pop up every other month covering this subject so I refuse to accept that accurate info isn't out there for those that look for it.
As I said I do agree with you that all firms could do more to advocate the use of drop-off systems without leadcore. Also, I wasn't referring to inexperienced anglers when I used the term 'idiots' - although it's funny how newer anglers and 'anglers who make mistakes' seem perfectly capable of seeking out accurate info related to munga and such like.
If you Google "Korda leadcore dropping the lead" did you expect to find anything other than the Heli Safe?
Googling "ESP dropping the lead" would likely see something from ESP (in fact I just did that and it shows the ESP guide to drop-off inlines on leadcore). Same deal.
Now if we Google "safe carp angling" which would make much more sense for someone trying to find out about safe carp angling, you immediately hit countless videos and articles on safe carp angling.
This is basically just the same discussion about the safety of leadcore that's been going on for years and years - since lead core was introduced. The Heli Safe is just the same as any other lead clip or drop off system. Nothing has changed. This is a burnt out subject as you said in your initial post (but no less important for it). There are threads pop up every other month covering this subject so I refuse to accept that accurate info isn't out there for those that look for it.
As I said I do agree with you that all firms could do more to advocate the use of drop-off systems without leadcore. Also, I wasn't referring to inexperienced anglers when I used the term 'idiots' - although it's funny how newer anglers and 'anglers who make mistakes' seem perfectly capable of seeking out accurate info related to munga and such like.
In reply to Post #18
I agree that there is a huge amount of good info out there. However there is a huge amount of confused, badly explained and misleading stuff on the net, YouTube, vlogs, blogs and in mags. And not just about fish safety.
To call beginners and inexperienced anglers idiots is, I'm sorry to say, arrogant nonsense. We all started there. There are a good number of people making good money from carp angling and angling in general. Bait deal, tackle deals, promotions, the manufacturers etc. They should be doing better, less ego, more sense.
The money, all of it, comes from the ordinary Joe's, beginners, idiots, and anglers in general. My 52 years experience allows me to filter out most of the rubbish from what I see, hear and read. For a lot of anglers that is not the case. Money is the curse.
I agree that there is a huge amount of good info out there. However there is a huge amount of confused, badly explained and misleading stuff on the net, YouTube, vlogs, blogs and in mags. And not just about fish safety.
To call beginners and inexperienced anglers idiots is, I'm sorry to say, arrogant nonsense. We all started there. There are a good number of people making good money from carp angling and angling in general. Bait deal, tackle deals, promotions, the manufacturers etc. They should be doing better, less ego, more sense.
The money, all of it, comes from the ordinary Joe's, beginners, idiots, and anglers in general. My 52 years experience allows me to filter out most of the rubbish from what I see, hear and read. For a lot of anglers that is not the case. Money is the curse.
In reply to Post #23
To be clear, I wasn't calling beginners and inexperienced anglers idiots. I was referring to those that should know better
And I agree with you that there is a huge amount of confused, badly explained and misleading stuff about EVERYTHING on the net.
To be clear, I wasn't calling beginners and inexperienced anglers idiots. I was referring to those that should know better
And I agree with you that there is a huge amount of confused, badly explained and misleading stuff about EVERYTHING on the net.
In reply to Post #22
Yonny
We'll have to agree to disagree mate, New anglers never google "safe" and its not their fault for not doing so.
They google the latest rigs
You are further down the road assuming people already have some prior knowledge that fishing rigs can be dangerous and have a duty to search out the information you suggest before tying up the rigs.
Try asking a non angler what he/she understands to be a safe fishing rig and in most instances you'll be met with a blank look.
What happens when these same people walk into a tackle shop to buy carp gear for the first time? Wheres all the information on fish safety?
There isnt any
A lot more could be done to educate newbies both at junior level within fishing clubs and at any level on product packaging and a lot more needs to be done in the angling media.
Yonny
We'll have to agree to disagree mate, New anglers never google "safe" and its not their fault for not doing so.
They google the latest rigs
You are further down the road assuming people already have some prior knowledge that fishing rigs can be dangerous and have a duty to search out the information you suggest before tying up the rigs.
Try asking a non angler what he/she understands to be a safe fishing rig and in most instances you'll be met with a blank look.
What happens when these same people walk into a tackle shop to buy carp gear for the first time? Wheres all the information on fish safety?
There isnt any
A lot more could be done to educate newbies both at junior level within fishing clubs and at any level on product packaging and a lot more needs to be done in the angling media.
In reply to Post #25
I don't think we're that far away from the same page mate
I don't think we're that far away from the same page mate
In reply to Post #26
Nice one
Nice one
In reply to Post #24
Beginners and inexperienced anglers should know better, they have a duty of care, a responsibility and consideration. Qualities that many lack.
The likes of korda could be using their high profile to publicise this but muh, profits and TV status.
Beginners and inexperienced anglers should know better, they have a duty of care, a responsibility and consideration. Qualities that many lack.
The likes of korda could be using their high profile to publicise this but muh, profits and TV status.
In reply to Post #28
You neglected to include experienced anglers in your statement, nit picking perhaps but obviously the duty of care applied to us all.
I've seen a carp tethered to a clump of rushes by just a plain length of line so the unexpected can and will happen.
Hopefully the risk diminishes with experience but anything on a line must increase the danger to the carp even if it's set up correctly.
You neglected to include experienced anglers in your statement, nit picking perhaps but obviously the duty of care applied to us all.
I've seen a carp tethered to a clump of rushes by just a plain length of line so the unexpected can and will happen.
Hopefully the risk diminishes with experience but anything on a line must increase the danger to the carp even if it's set up correctly.
In reply to Post #29
This can apply to any leaders not just leadcore. I have used leadcore on a helicopter setup for nearly 20 years. Never dropped the lead as I don't feel it's needed. Any form of leader is generally 30-45lb ish breaking strain. They can all be lethal. Personally I think people need to stop using 25lb hooklengths when using any form of leader as most of the time they have 12-15lb line. I've never used more than 15lb (bar the original stuff link). I would much rather the weak link be the hooklength so if anything will snap it will be that rather than the mainline.
This can apply to any leaders not just leadcore. I have used leadcore on a helicopter setup for nearly 20 years. Never dropped the lead as I don't feel it's needed. Any form of leader is generally 30-45lb ish breaking strain. They can all be lethal. Personally I think people need to stop using 25lb hooklengths when using any form of leader as most of the time they have 12-15lb line. I've never used more than 15lb (bar the original stuff link). I would much rather the weak link be the hooklength so if anything will snap it will be that rather than the mainline.